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wtf is the latest gaming outrage about? - Page 3

post #101 of 293

I haven't properly played any of them (I've had Indigo Prophecy for years, but it's on the pile. I've got Omikron as well and will probably never play it). I mean yeah it kind of looks like a megabudget take on Dragon's Lair, maybe it will suck.

 

But the guy might have bit of a point about "would you ask this question of a film director?". About the worst specific criticism of the trailer seems to be that it's cliched, but there generally isn't an explosion of controversy when movies show pretty similar depictions of the same thing.

post #102 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul C View Post

But the guy might have bit of a point about "would you ask this question of a film director?". About the worst specific criticism of the trailer seems to be that it's cliched, but there generally isn't an explosion of controversy when movies show pretty similar depictions of the same thing.
A. that's because when movies do that, they're generally something like henrybook that people can just dismiss out of hand for unrelated reasons, and B. this is David Cage, so the "would you ask this question of a film director!?" is less an honest question and more a symptom of the raging insecurity over not being in the Cool Film Directors Club that has defined his entire career post-doing-music-for-Virgin-Interactive. Remember, this is the guy who just a few short years ago was standing onstage at E3 pissing in D.W. Griffith's cornflakes because the new PSXBone4u has way more pixels than The Great Train Robbery. He doesn't know shit about movies any more than he knows shit about games, he just desperately wants to be recognized as the genius auteur he knows he is.
post #103 of 293

but are video games art?

post #104 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcnooj82 View Post
 

but are video games art?

Dear lord, you are going to summon HIM by posting that question.

And piss off Roger Ebert's ghost.

post #105 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcnooj82 View Post

but are video games art?
Cage's worlds of creepy plastic androids attempting to convey hu-man emotion verge on outsider art, I suppose.
post #106 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcnooj82 View Post
 

but are video games art?

 

Yes.

 

David Cage games are BAD art though. 

post #107 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by Codename View Post
 

 

David Cage games are BRILLIANT art though. 

 

post #108 of 293
Thread Starter 

That was amazing! 

post #109 of 293
I had to mute it because the laugh track was annoying, but pretty damn funny. I particularly love him slipping around on the ice while someone is just walking normal behind him.
post #110 of 293

My favorite part is right after when he starts digging his hands into the seafood, desperately trying to pull himself up. Then, ChickenCam.

post #111 of 293
Thread Starter 

I watched about half of the interview between Angry Joe and a spokesman for EA regarding Star Wars Battlefront 2 and I suddenly felt compelled to applaud the guy. His corporate-BS powers are truly stunning to behold. If you thought the RNG of loot boxes was bad, you've been looking at them incorrectly. It's actually a good thing that you can't just outright buy what you need because, when you get something you don't need, it basically means you're trying out stuff you wouldn't have done before! 

post #112 of 293
One of the reasons I dont game anymore is bc of the takeover of multiplayer, and that seems inherently biased toward hard core gamers who have time to devote 8 - 12 hours a day toward becoming really good, vs someone like me who just does not have that kind of time, so I end up being dropped in the middle of a shooting gallery with a target on my back. I think I tried multiplayer a couple times and was just appalled at how outmatched I was and constantly losing is not fun at all, so I gave up. There seems to be very little actual strategy involved either, just a bunch of itchy trigger fingers shooting at anything that moves. Just not my thing at all. If thats the direction games are headed, no fucking thank you.
post #113 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob Singer View Post

The guys at Penny Arcade don't seem to be too happy with Patrick Soderlund:



Is that about Visceral Games getting closed down? I'm really having a hard time seeing why anyone really gives a shit about that. The Visceral Games of today isn't the Visceral Game that created Dead Space, whose people left years ago to form Slughammer Games and have been doing Call of Duty games since the Call of Duty guys left to form Respawn with EA.

Funnily enough EA just bought Respawn following the closer of Visceral.
post #114 of 293

post #115 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcnooj82 View Post

but are video games art?


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by SimBOB View Post



Is that about Visceral Games getting closed down? I'm really having a hard time seeing why anyone really gives a shit about that. The Visceral Games of today isn't the Visceral Game that created Dead Space, whose people left years ago to form Slughammer Games and have been doing Call of Duty games since the Call of Duty guys left to form Respawn with EA.



Funnily enough EA just bought Respawn following the closer of Visceral.

 



The story is coming out at a time where people are really frustrated over the "games as services" sentiment that Publishers seem to be pimping out. So not surprise that people are freaking out.
post #116 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ska Oreo View Post


The story is coming out at a time where people are really frustrated over the "games as services" sentiment that Publishers seem to be pimping out. So not surprise that people are freaking out.

I just find it funny that people that should know better, people actually in gamings journalism, (or fancy themselves to be) seem to be fueling the outrage. I mean, Visceral isn't even a studio EA bought up, they don't even play into that EA meme about how they kill great studios. Visceral is just some internal EA studio, and the people that made the game of theirs people like left years ago.

The fight over games as a service seems kind of funny, at least the idea of it. There's actually only been a relatively short period where there never really was this games as a service thing. Arcades were games as a service after all. The only real problem seems to be how they're going about it, which is adapting free-to-play models to full price $60 games. They want do use the free-to-play model, they should roll the dice and make these games free-to-play...a good deal of them would probably make more money that way anyways.
post #117 of 293
EA is having a helluva day addressing their lootbox shit. Some guy did maths and determined normal non-lootbox funded gameplay would require 40 hours of playtime to unlock any of the heroes.

Which begs the question (with obvious answer): Why the fuck are Heroes/Villains gated behind a paywall for a $60 game?
EA: Fucking piles of big cash $$$ son.
Quote:
EA's response:

The intent is to provide players with a sense of pride and accomplishment for unlocking different heroes.

As for cost, we selected initial values based upon data from the Open Beta and other adjustments made to milestone rewards before launch. Among other things, we're looking at average per-player credit earn rates on a daily basis, and we'll be making constant adjustments to ensure that players have challenges that are compelling, rewarding, and of course attainable via gameplay.

The bolded shit is just gross. I spend whole weeks of my life making games because I want people to have fun with the shit we've made. Nowhere at any point did I decide, fuck yeah I want to nickle and dime kids (or their parents money away) with microtransactions.

At some point today, the Sledgehammer Games community manager got frustrated with the lootbox drama and tweeted this, before deleting it:



He has since deleted it and is now playing the victim card on his feed. As a developer, this shit is gross. I've had a late coffee with my former supervisor, who worked at DICE, and this whole release is just a shitshow. If you don't like the public response to the monetization choices you've made, either get rid of them or accept the hate and cancelled pre-orders.

They've been taking a beating this whole weekend, since the game released on EA Access, the corporate slave owners trotted out the design director to address the complaints.
Quote:
Apologies for not being more active these past weeks leading up to launch - as you know things get really hectic and you tend to spend whatever spare freetime you have recovering. I really regret not being here on the subreddit at the start of the early access. Hopefully some of these replies will bring some clarity and hope.

Performance during games will affect the amount of credits you get at the end of a match.

Matchmaking will take into account not only player skill, but also total gametime and rarity of star cards. This means that you will be matchmade with players with an average performance similar to you and (to the largest extent possible) not against players who are much better than you, whether by having higher rarity cards or by showing higher skill.

Heroes that are locked at launch will only be unlocked with credits, not crystals. The heroes, similar to the locked weapons for Troopers, are sidegrades instead of upgrades (Darth Vader should be on similar power level as Darth Maul, etc). The goal is to keep you playing for a long time and have something cool to look forward to as you earn credits.

Speaking of earning credits, we're constantly evaluating and tweaking the earn rates versus the cost of crates and heroes. The current rates were based on open beta data, but you should expect us to constantly evolve these numbers as we hit launch and onwards. There will also be more milestones that award credits and crafting parts available, as well as star cards only unlockable through those milestones. If all you want to do is play and grind towards your next unlock that will be fully possible and we'll continue to tweak the numbers until the requirements feel fun and achievable.

Working on a game with a live economy and without a premium content lineup is a new challenge for us at DICE. We had one progression system in the closed alpha and heard your feedback back then. We made another iteration for the open beta and heard your feedback then too. For launch, we're having another iteration and there will definitely be more iterations as we evolve this game post launch.

Your continous feedback as you play the game is absolutely invaluable and I encourage you to keep sending it our way. There is really no reason to "rebel" against us - we want this game to be as great and enjoyable as it can be - we're reading all your feedback and working as fast as we can to adjust the game to your liking.

No matter what he says or promises to do, this is all still massive piles of bullshit. Monetization came first, then gameplay, and story. That was EA's directive with churning out a new Battlefront game.

And for a slight cherry on top, PC Gamer's review of Need For Speed Payback: Pouring loot boxes on a tire fire
Quote:
Need for Speed: Payback is the first game to be ruined by loot boxes. Obviously it’s not the first game to have loot boxes—we’ve been actively discussing them and their role in games for the last few months, thanks to Forza Motorsport 7 and Middle-earth: Shadow of War and “Is this gambling?” and so on.

But I’m talking ruined. In Need for Speed: Payback, we have a totally decent arcade racer undermined at every turn by rampant and predatory monetization. It should be a cautionary tale for the rest of the industry.

Normal racing games work like this: You race cars, you earn money, you use that money to either buy better cars or upgrade your current vehicle with new parts—a more powerful engine, grippier tires, a lighter-weight frame, and so on. This is how Need for Speed has also worked for years now.

Not Payback! Payback ditches all of the under-the-hood tweaking entirely, replacing it instead with a totally incomprehensible “Speed Card” system. Each car has six Speed Card slots, which roughly equate to actual car parts—Block, ECU, Turbo, Exhaust, Gearbox, and Head.

Each race you’re rewarded with a random Speed Card to put in one of these slots. Say you do a street race in Silver Rock a.k.a. faux-Vegas. After winning, you’ll get a new Speed Card for your car, maybe bumping its “Block” rating from a completely arbitrary 3 to a still-arbitrary-except-it’s-slightly-higher 4.

This is all then tallied up in ways that are again completely impenetrable to the player, and your car receives an overall rating. Lower-end cars have a rating of about 120. Fully-upgraded cars mostly top out at 300, with a handful of cars going up to 399.

Oh, and did I mention Speed Cards can’t be shared between cars? Because they can’t. Even Speed Cards you aren’t using, ones that are just sitting in your inventory because you have better options available, are completely useless. You can sell them or trade them in for Tokens, but if you buy a new car it starts from scratch and you need to repeat any of the previous options to build up an entirely new set of Speed Cards.

You unlock the next tier and instead of it starting at 180 like you’d expect, every race immediately “Recommends” a car of at least Level 210. Hope you have money or tokens lying around, otherwise you’re running old races ad nauseum and hoping something good drops or...buying loot boxes. And heaven forbid you bought a new car (or decided to use your newly-repaired derelict) instead of continuing to use that crappy Honda you got at the start of the game. If that’s the case, you’re not starting at 155—you’re potentially starting as low as 120. Again, all of your cards are locked to the car you earned them in. Not even the division! You can’t just unequip the cards from your last Drag car and move them to your new one. Nope! Nothing!

It’s garbage. It’s the worst system I’ve ever seen in a singleplayer racing game, or any full-price singleplayer game.

I wish more reviewers were this honest about lootbox-centric games.
post #118 of 293

mongy brings the intel.

post #119 of 293


I'm becoming a fucking meme at this point....fuck lootboxes.

I'm just going to fire up some Mario. Maybe check out Doom on the Switch. There are better ways of wasting my time.
post #120 of 293

Man...FUCK EA! 

post #121 of 293

Haven't played an EA game in years and it looks like that won't be changing for the foreseeable future.

post #122 of 293
What really drives me crazy is the knowledge that there are thousands of gamers who are going to read all about this horseshit and then buy the fucking thing anyway because they're just conditioned to purchase any shit the publisher feels like shoveling out of pure, blind brand loyalty.
post #123 of 293

Just FYI, you can buy the OG Battlefront II on GOG for like $10. And they STILL have Servers for games. Harken back to those glorious Halcyon days...when games released completely finished and they didn't lock parts of them behind fucking gambling and paywalls. 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Headless Fett View Post
 

Haven't played an EA game in years and it looks like that won't be changing for the foreseeable future.

 

I've supported them for years and even stuck up for them at times...after this latest shitshow though. Fuck 'em. Dead to me. 

post #124 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post

What really drives me crazy is the knowledge that there are thousands of gamers who are going to read all about this horseshit and then buy the fucking thing anyway because they're just conditioned to purchase any shit the publisher feels like shoveling out of pure, blind brand loyalty.

 

post #125 of 293
Thread Starter 

I briefly debated getting SWB2 when they announced changes to their system but I'm going back to my original way of thinking: I'll grab it when it's heavily discounted, mainly for the campaign. The money I would have spent on it will probably go toward Injustice 2 now. 

post #126 of 293
It is my hope (a fool's hope probably) that this clusterfuck results in Disney pulling the rights for SW games from EA. Not for any ideological reasons of course, but simply cause EA is fucking with THE BRAND.

I'm just gonna buy some of the classic games like KOTOR, Republic Commando and X-Wing on GOG and remember the good ol' days. Fuck giving EA another cent.
post #127 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by mongycore View Post

EA is having a helluva day addressing their lootbox shit. Some guy did maths and determined normal non-lootbox funded gameplay would require 40 hours of playtime to unlock any of the heroes.

Which begs the question (with obvious answer): Why the fuck are Heroes/Villains gated behind a paywall for a $60 game?
EA: Fucking piles of big cash $$$ son.
 

 

That response from EA you quoted?

 

It's now the most downvoted comment in Reddit history. Over 130, 000 Downvotes and counting. 

 

Kek. 

post #128 of 293
Thread Starter 

This whole thing really fucking annoys me. I would love to have bought SWB2. Destiny 2 has re-awakened my love for First Person Shooters, and who doesn't love Star Wars? They would almost certainly have made money from me and, if there had been non-gameplay affecting microtransactions in the game, I'd have likely thrown them a few pounds if I enjoyed the game enough. This way? They're going to get five to ten pounds in a few months. I'm not even annoyed by their stupid money-grabbing antics. I'm annoyed that they've cheated me out of a game I probably would have ended up loving. 

post #129 of 293

That's the pisser. Battlefront 2 is a good game mechanically. It plays great. It looks great. It's in match progression system is good. They had all the right ingredients and then the money men just took a giant steaming shit in the pot.

Seriously, 40 hours to unlock a single character?! It's insane! And these aren't minor heroes either. It's fucking Luke, Leia, Vader and Palpatine! The predatory fucks knew exactly what they were doing. Fuck them. 

 

Oh, and that EA response is now on 182 000 + Downvotes. 

post #130 of 293
Thread Starter 
My favorite Reddit comment in regards to the historical number of downvotes that EA comment has now gotten:
"We can't repel downvotes of that magnatude!" - EA
post #131 of 293

Just hit 200,000! 

 

To give you some perspective; the previous holder for that record was just over 20,000 downvotes. And that was someone actively ASKING to be downvoted! 

post #132 of 293
If there was ever a candidate for a game to offer an option to only buy its single player portion at at a reduced price, and pay the rest for the multiplayer later on if you choose, SWBF2 is it.

As it is, I'm with others here. I'll wait for a massive sale or used price just for the campaign.
post #133 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSaxon View Post
 

I briefly debated getting SWB2 when they announced changes to their system but I'm going back to my original way of thinking: I'll grab it when it's heavily discounted, mainly for the campaign. The money I would have spent on it will probably go toward Injustice 2 now. 

Injustice 2 is a pretty good example here.

Its loot boxes only work on (aside from aesthetics) certain online game modes, and even the dreaded season pass issue has been rendered moot by just how far Netherealm have gone to make the Fighter Packs be worth it in terms of characters added (I mean, we are at 9 new characters now, and the guest characters have been well received).

post #134 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by Codename View Post
 

Just hit 200,000! 

 

To give you some perspective; the previous holder for that record was just over 20,000 downvotes. And that was someone actively ASKING to be downvoted! 

 

Wow.  If EA isn't seriously having a come to Jesus moment, I don't know what to think...

post #135 of 293

I got a discount on the pre-order, and I'll be happily playing the campaign this weekend. I'm not interested in the multiplayer at all, unless they have some of those 2-player co-op missions from the last Battlefront. I'm hoping for some way to do flight missions outside of multiplayer, too, even if it's just a practice mode. 

 

I couldn't care less about multiplayer loot boxes and unlocking heroes.

post #136 of 293

Not even buying it reduced.  And I bought the damn Darth Vader edition Battlefront PS4.  If I have to wait forever for a proper single player Star Wars game, then wait I will. I have plenty of other games to play.  Still enjoying the hell out of Destiny 2.  And while they have a store for micro transactions, I've never once felt like I needed to pay real money for anything. I don't need fancy shaders or ships to go out there, shoot aliens in the face and kick ass.

post #137 of 293
EA is probably gonna wait and see if downvotes equal lost revenue. How many mainstream buyers actually read and care about online gaming news and corporate PR statements? 10-20%? The average person walking into a Gamestop will still go "Oh, new Star Wars Battlefront? So shiny."
post #138 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyle Reese View Post

EA is probably gonna wait and see if downvotes equal lost revenue. How many mainstream buyers actually read and care about online gaming news and corporate PR statements? 10-20%? The average person walking into a Gamestop will still go "Oh, new Star Wars Battlefront? So shiny."

 

Reminds me of Chappelle's joke about somebody being super angry about something and their rage boiling down to them pressing the "don't like" button.

post #139 of 293

366,000 downvotes.

post #140 of 293

When they can downvote Trump out of office, get back to me.

post #141 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambler View Post

Wow.  If EA isn't seriously having a come to Jesus moment, I don't know what to think...

 

In gaming, if the response is anything but stone cold apathy from the community, that's a win. 

 

Do I think this will amount to anything? Of fucking course not, I'm not an idiot. But this predatory bullshit needs to be called out and not supported at every opportunity because it's already taking over the industry. At this point, the best hope is Government legislation to regulate this shit and even THAT is most likely not gonna happen.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob Singer View Post
 

I got a discount on the pre-order, and I'll be happily playing the campaign this weekend. I'm not interested in the multiplayer at all, unless they have some of those 2-player co-op missions from the last Battlefront. I'm hoping for some way to do flight missions outside of multiplayer, too, even if it's just a practice mode. 

 

I couldn't care less about multiplayer loot boxes and unlocking heroes.

 

Except this shit's already creeping into single player games with alarming regularity. And when EA gets away with this shit, it's just gonna get worse and worse. Want to play the next level? Well you'll just have to replay all the previous ones for 50 hours to unlock it, or skip the wait and buy these Level Cards! That shit is absolutely on it's way. 

 

"At first they came for the Multiplayer games, and I did not care, cause I'm not a Multiplayer gamer..." 

post #142 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by Codename View Post
 

 

In gaming, if the response is anything but stone cold apathy from the community, that's a win. 

 

Do I think this will amount to anything? Of fucking course not, I'm not an idiot. But this predatory bullshit needs to be called out and not supported at every opportunity because it's already taking over the industry. At this point, the best hope is Government legislation to regulate this shit and even THAT is most likely not gonna happen.

 

I just don't understand how they are getting away with putting casino style loot boxes in games rated safe for kids.  That blows my mind.  

post #143 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambler View Post
 

 

I just don't understand how they are getting away with putting casino style loot boxes in games rated safe for kids.  That blows my mind.  

 

Because they're sneaky as fuck, that's why. 

 

You don't ACTUALLY buy the lootboxes with real life money, you buy it with a made-up in-game currency. Now the made-up in-game currency you can buy with real money! It's sort of a buffer between legally being defined as gambling or not. A loophole they exploit to the fullest. 

 

The law on this shit is woefully outdated and doesn't adapt to the changing technological landscape and needs to be changed pronto. 

post #144 of 293

The speed of tech development outpaced the efficacy of federal regulation a long time ago.

 

Another example: commercial drone operation

post #145 of 293
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Codename View Post

 

Because they're sneaky as fuck, that's why. 

 

You don't ACTUALLY buy the lootboxes with real life money, you buy it with a made-up in-game currency. Now the made-up in-game currency you can buy with real money! It's sort of a buffer between legally being defined as gambling or not. A loophole they exploit to the fullest. 

 

 

Slightly off-topic, but it makes me thinks of the Pachinko parlours in Japan where gambling is outlawed. If you win, you get a nice toy and - hey, here's a remarkable coincidence! - there just happens to be a place next door that's not connected to the parlour in any way (fingers crossed) but will happily buy those toys for money.

post #146 of 293

The point shouldn't be lost that it's now at a point where these companies (EA in particular) are using psychological tricks to abuse people with addictive tendencies. That's beyond greed.

post #147 of 293

This is my favorite comment from one of the articles on the EA downvote thing.

 

Quote:

 The problem is that EA saying they built this grind this way to give the players a “sense of accomplishment” and then allowing people to completely circumvent the thing by using real world money is disingenuous.

 

Where’s the sense of accomplishment if you’re running around in a Vader you grinded for, and you could come across some guy who just had extra cash to spend and gets the same result?

 

Guy nails it.

post #148 of 293

it is all completely disingenous. Gaming is predatory now, that is where the profits lie. I refuse to spend money on any game where spending money equals a competitive advantage. But the sad part is, games are now hiding the competitive advantages given to spenders and also to new players.

 

I was part of a huge discussion of hearthstone. A game that is made to appear random. We were getting into the ways it is not random, and devising tests to prove it when the mods came in and shut it down after weeks of debate when the Blizzard plants started losing. Basically the predatory tactics used by F2P games are now going to be used in any big title put out by a major publisher. Because it is really is that lucrative.

 

Something as seemingly simple as the matchmaking in overwatch is actually incredibly convoluted...with the goal  to push all players towards a 50 percent win rate and in so encourage player retention. By doing so, they keep a wider base to buy their loot boxes. 

 

http://www.rollingstone.com/glixel/news/how-activision-uses-matchmaking-tricks-to-sell-in-game-items-w509288

 

you can expect crap like this going forward in all premium titles. 

post #149 of 293

That story says that they're not using that technique. Yet.

post #150 of 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob Singer View Post
 

That story says that they're not using that technique. Yet.

yes, they are using something right now though. it is a lot to get into, but their matchmaking tweaking began in Starcraft in order to retain customers in a high skill cap game. Basically, they use two numbers for matchmaking, the SR which is displayed and a MMR which is hidden and can be variable based on what class/deck/character you are playing. 

 

The patent is mainly a way for them to feed you losses against a player with stuff you don't have so you go and buy it. 

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