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COCO (2017) Discussion Thread

post #1 of 56
Thread Starter 
I thought this was really fantastic.

The story plays out about as I'd expected as far as animated films go, but its execution is so lovely and emotional.

Just be aware, to enjoy this movie, you have to sit through a goddamned 22 minute Frozen Christmas Special 'short'.

The super cynical part of me assumes that Disney tacked this interminable chore in order to 'balance' out the subject matter of the feature.
post #2 of 56

Excellente.

 

Oh my god are you serious 22 MINUTES? I didn't even make it that far into my attempt at a 2nd viewing of Frozen 1.

post #3 of 56
Thread Starter 
21:50!

I timed it because I was certain a friend who saw it before me was exagerrating for effect when she told me it was 20 minutes long.

Not only is it that long, but it's also not good.

COCO really made up for it though. I'm really glad the film's relative lack of buzz allowed me to go in pretty blind.
post #4 of 56

The main draw for me on COCO is the color palette.  All of the stills that I've seen for it are really fantastic looking, and I think that this will be a visual treat in the theater.  Glad to hear that it's good, as I'm seeing it at some point this coming week.

post #5 of 56

It also seems this was a HUGE hit in Mexico.

As in biggest opening weekend and weekly box office ever.

Which is good, because Pixar went above and beyond in paying respect to Mexican culture and tradition without cheaply appropiating it.*

 

*Also, that sandal wielding Granny. All latinos fear and respect the power of ¡La Chancla!.

post #6 of 56
Thread Starter 
It's a gorgeous film for sure!

I'm also really glad to hear that the film really made a good faith effort to be respectful of Mexican culture.

Though I'm still waiting for some thinkpieces!
post #7 of 56

I really look forward to seeing this.

 

The main draw for me is the music.  How is it?

 

And does this have a lot in common with The Book of Life?  

post #8 of 56
Thread Starter 
I never saw book of life.

Are you talking about the score? Or the songs in the movie? I didn't particularly take notice of Giacchino's score, but the songs played in the movie are really nice and build up some of the movie's best moments.
post #9 of 56
I just remember when this was announced I thought "This sounds a lot like Book of Life" so I was just wondering if their was a distinction.

BUT YOU DON'T KNOW!

Musically the Book of Life kind of just tweaked popular songs. I'm really interested in the original music in Coco.
post #10 of 56
Book of Life was so bad.
post #11 of 56
Thread Starter 
Found this on IMDB trivia:

Hehehe well done Mexico audiences!!!

"Despite the success of Frozen (2013) the not-quite-short film Olaf's Frozen Adventure (2017) received serious complaints from moviegoers in Mexico for its longer than usual length, subpar quality compared to the source material and it being a nonstop 20 minute long, Christmas-themed musical number. Complaints were so numerous that the two largest movie theatre chains in the country opted to stop showing the Frozen short film before the movie just a week after opening day."
post #12 of 56
Thread Starter 
post #13 of 56

 

haha came in here to post exactly this! 

post #14 of 56

I really enjoy the thought of Pixar taking some risks with this one and the general premise of it, but for whatever reason the trailers and promotional stuff have left me totally cold. I have had zero interest in seeing it. I can't really put my finger on why, but I think primarily the hook for the story seems a bit vague (perhaps intentionally) and aesthetically I wish I was seeing something a bit darker or more bizarre, like Day of the Dead come Pixar Beetlejuice or whatever. The visual aspect of the trailers was not nearly what I hoped. But, eh, they're just trailers.

 

Sooo... good to hear the movie works. Will definitely check out at some point.

post #15 of 56
Thread Starter 

Yeah, I wasn't particularly jazzed by the one teaser or trailer I saw either.

 

And so I just kinda avoided seeing too much more about it.  It was refreshing to go into a Pixar movie that way.

post #16 of 56

The Frozen short is the perfect length to have a couple of commercial breaks shoved into it and run on network TV every Christmas.  Which was likely the plan all along.

 

As for Coco, it's an absolute joy.

post #17 of 56
Thread Starter 
I've been told it was indeed meant to be a TV special.
post #18 of 56
I thought this was really great, though I am still trying to figure out how I feel about a couple elements of the end. As beautiful as Miguel singing Remember Me to Coco is, it feels a touch manipulative. And I didn’t love the fact that the end seems to indicate that Imelda forgave Hector. I liked the idea that, even if Imelda is willing to let Hector back in the family and reconnect with music, that the pain Hector caused her still runs too deep for her to truly forgive him. He is obviously sympathetic and clearly feels very guilty about leaving his family...but he still left his family. The end of that storyline, imo, maybe puts a bit too neat of a conclusion onto an otherwise nuanced portrayal.
post #19 of 56

My only nitpick is that I tweaked on to the twist almost immediately.  Fortunately, the entire film doesn't hinge on it,

 

Oh, and the fact that they couldn't get Salma Hayek to voice Frida.

post #20 of 56
Thread Starter 
oh the movie is VERY predictable

but I really didn't mind considering how I responded to it anyway
post #21 of 56

Yeah, it's definitely a case where the joy comes not from pulling it over on the audience, but watching the characters figure it out.

post #22 of 56
Thread Starter 

the movie was a slightly odd experience for me in that I was always emotionally engaged with it... while at the same time processing the way its narrative was engineered considering the studio behind it and what I know about their general philosophy when it comes to story

post #23 of 56

I guess I'm an old softy, because stuff like that doesn't enter my mind while I'm watching a film that captures me the way this did.

post #24 of 56
Thread Starter 

but you tweaked on the twist immediately!

 

YOU HAVE THE POWAH!!!

 

THE POWAH OF TWO BRAINS!!!

 

as I said, deconstructing the film while watching it did nothing to stop me from my eyes getting moist for the third act.

post #25 of 56

That's internal film stuff though!  

 

And yeah, I started losing it when Miguel was saying goodbye to Hector and pretty much didn't stop until the end.  The last ten minutes of this does for happy crying what the first ten minutes of Up did for ugly crying.

post #26 of 56

And another great thing about this is that it doesn't try to be Mexican Culture for Dummies.  It let's a lot of the folklore and language just exist.  Sure, they explain Dia de los Muertos and the pictures, but that's central to the plot.  But dropping in the occasional Spanish words and having some of the songs entirely in Spanish was great, as were the spirit animals.

post #27 of 56
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Dickson View Post
 

 

And yeah, I started losing it when Miguel was saying goodbye to Hector and pretty much didn't stop until the end.  The last ten minutes of this does for happy crying what the first ten minutes of Up did for ugly crying.

 

N65P9gL.gif

post #28 of 56
Thread Starter 

Some idle thoughts I had during the film in the following block:

 

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
a minor personal complaint I have about the movie is that I was disappointed when a blatant villain eventually pops into the narrative (kinda reminding me of UP in that way)
 
before the fun telenovela-ish reveal happens (and to be fair, it was not a reveal I saw coming secifically), I was really hoping that the film would try not to shoehorn a villain into it...
 
because I was really enjoying thinking about how the film would deal with the conflict between pursuing your bliss and family duty
 
and the reveal really results in brushing off that compelling and relatable internal conflict and turning it into an external mustache-twirling threat... COMPLETE with 'villain unwittingly revealing his dastardly deeds to the whole world via secret recording!'
 
As COULD said above, it's all a bit TOO tidy. 
 
BUT... it just WORKS SO WELL ANYWAY.
 
 
 
oh, and in regards to what's going on in Hollywood today...
 
When it's revealed that de la Cruz incorporated the way he poisoned Hector into one of his films, I found myself thinking about Louis CK's abuse of power and him 'revealing' some of those ideas in his art.

Edited by mcnooj82 - 11/23/17 at 11:20am
post #29 of 56
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Kids, be good to your biological family. They may be horribly abusive, but the alternative is an existentially terrifying fate.

Morals.

post #30 of 56
Thread Starter 
ah the job of any HARDCORE children's tale!
post #31 of 56

Were there any GRIM FANDANGO easter eggs?

post #32 of 56
I did see a poster on a wall in the background in the Land of the Dead that had a skull on it that looked a bit like Manny.
post #33 of 56

Just got back from seeing an All-Spanish version of this. Even not understanding the language (only a teeny weeny bit), I could still decipher the jest of the story. I thought it all looked wonderful and is definitely one of PIXAR's best looking features. Am definitely seeing this again. I loved the story, too.

 

I especially loved the opening sequence. 

 

This felt like PIXAR at the height of its storytelling prowess. 

post #34 of 56
Thread Starter 
I wanna see the Spanish language release!
post #35 of 56

I will say despite not understanding the language, the Spanish added to the story and the look of the feature.  Not that it needed it, it all looks so good, but it just did.

post #36 of 56
Thread Starter 

oh god, you know a film has gotten to you when even the Spanish language version of Ernesto de la Cruz festively singing REMEMBER ME is getting me all emotional...

 

 

that MELODY!!!

 

 

post #37 of 56
Thread Starter 
post #38 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcnooj82 View Post

Found this on IMDB trivia:

Hehehe well done Mexico audiences!!!

"Despite the success of Frozen (2013) the not-quite-short film Olaf's Frozen Adventure (2017) received serious complaints from moviegoers in Mexico for its longer than usual length, subpar quality compared to the source material and it being a nonstop 20 minute long, Christmas-themed musical number. Complaints were so numerous that the two largest movie theatre chains in the country opted to stop showing the Frozen short film before the movie just a week after opening day."
Wait, wait, wait, a single nonstop 20-minute musical number?

That...one the one hand, that's a mind-bogglingly terrible idea. On the other hand, that'd get the progressive-rock fan in me a little hard if it weren't for the fact that most of Frozen's music wasn't actually that good.
post #39 of 56

Very good movie. Don't know if I'd put it at the top of the Pixar pile, but it was satisfying and moving.

 

Is Disney on top of it with the merch production? I need one of those lion spirit guides on my desk.

 

Poco Loco was my favorite of the songs. That's also the name of an excellent taco truck in my area.

post #40 of 56
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by commodorejohn View Post

Wait, wait, wait, a single nonstop 20-minute musical number?

That...one the one hand, that's a mind-bogglingly terrible idea. On the other hand, that'd get the progressive-rock fan in me a little hard if it weren't for the fact that most of Frozen's music wasn't actually that good.

no it's not a nonstop musical number

it's like 3-4 musical numbers in a bland Christmas special storyline full of Olaf hijinks and lessons learned
post #41 of 56
Ah. Well that's even less interesting.
post #42 of 56

Most of it is Olaf warbling to himself in his dumb fucking Jerry Lewis voice, then at the end Blonde Sister belts out a Celine Dion style number about how Christ is in your heart when you shop at Target.

post #43 of 56
The Olaf short was teh suk.
post #44 of 56
Thread Starter 
post #45 of 56
I saw this again last night. It didn’t pack the same emotional punch, but I actually think I liked the film more. Some of the quibbles I has with the end and Imelda’s arc smoothed out for me in the second viewing.
post #46 of 56
Thread Starter 

Now that the Frozen short will soon be out of the way, I really want to make it out to see the Spanish language release.

post #47 of 56
I love that the short seems to have inspired such anger in people. Specifically that's it's 30 mins or that it's Frozen?

I remember as a kid seeing 30 mins shorts before Disney films. Anyone remember the Mickey Mouse Prince and the Pauper? Think it was before Rescuers Down Under. Nobody complained back then... well, maybe they did but, no Internet.
post #48 of 56
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by User_32 View Post

I love that the short seems to have inspired such anger in people. Specifically that's it's 30 mins or that it's Frozen?
 

and that it's neither good nor entertaining

 

and the 22 minutes feel even longer especially when audiences who first saw it had no idea it was going to be that long when they usually just expect a 4-6 minute short from Pixar itself

 

 

if the thing was actually any good, I assume there would be less complaints

post #49 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcnooj82 View Post

 

and the 22 minutes feel even longer especially when audiences who first saw it had no idea it was going to be that long when they usually just expect a 4-6 minute short from Pixar itself

 

 

I get that. But again, Disney did that shit all the time back in the 80s with 30 minute Mickey Mouse cartoons (Prince and the Pauper, A Christmas Carol). Maybe the features were shorter so they needed to pad things. 

post #50 of 56

Pixar has a higher standard of quality and humor than Disney Vanilla animation productions. When you go into the theater expecting Pixar quality, and instead you get bombarded with juvenile garbage made for 5 year olds, it's bound to cause agitation.

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