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I need 100% honest opinions and input.

post #1 of 10
7/15/02 at 2:53pm
Thread Starter 
I'm hitting brick walls with this band thing, trying to get us booked into shows. I've discussed it with my Father, a master businessman of more than 25 years, and he agrees that from a busniess standpoint, I am doing all I can and more to get our band out there. The hitch is, I'm not getting many callbacks or dates confirmed.

The sad conclusion that my Dad and I reached today is that our name and even our music may be the problem. Especially our name, which is obviously of religious significance, may be contributing to the lack of interest in us. This breaks my heart for several reasons.
1. It's a pretty cool name, and I worked hard designing the logo.
2. It DOES mean something to us.
3. It's sad that we seem to be rejected for the connotation of our name.

I guess we asked for it.
It's probably no secret that the guys in Sacrament are Christians. We have our thing going that we choose to believe in and live out and I'm sure there aren't very many people who would not AT LEAST respect that. Fine.
In our band, we write from our experiences and our lives. Hence, our faith enters the picture sometimes. Some songs have more spiritual influence than others, some none at all. It's just the way it is. That makes us real. We write the music that we write. Sometimes it has a spiritual focus, and sometimes it's just about being human. I don't think there is ANYTHING wrong with that, and you can't convince me otherwise. We can't and won't change how or what we write.

But then there's our name. Can we change that and still maintain integrity? Should we try to bulldoze our way through the opposition WITHOUT changing the name?
First of all, I want to ask you, the chewers who pay attention to this stuff, your opinion.
Does our name turn you off right away? Does the music turn you off? I know you haven't heard much, but does the whole "Christian" thing really bother you?

See, because here's my problem. I never wanted to be in a band that gets up on stage and starts prayig with the audience and telling them to give their hearts to Jesus. I never wanted to sing praise songs or lead people in hymns.
I wanted to be in a band that rocked hard and loud and fast and had screaming, writhing fans below the stage, pumping their fists in the air and headbanging and throwing the horns out every once in awhile. I wanted to be in a metal band. I still want to be in a heavy metal band.

Here's the other problem. If I gear my band more toward the secular end of things, do I then again compromise my integrity? Am I a bad Christian if I don't want to sing the praises of God all the time in every song? I mean, I can't do that anyway. I've always been in tune with the darker side of life anyway, and that's what I always write about. Real stuff. Stuff that people and especially kids go through. It doesn't always have anything to do with God. In fact, I spent a lot of my teenage years trying to get FAR away from God. So i write about both sides of life. And I don't and never would say anything AGAINST God, at least not in a blasphemous way. I mean read the Psalms; those are all railing against God pretty much.

So to Christians it probably seems like we're sitting on the fence. To secular audiences it would probably make us look like the enemy; Bible-thumping fire and brimstone converters.

I know the easy answer is, "Don't mix the two worlds," but that would be nearly impossible for me and for my bandmates. We write and play from our very selves, and just as every other human being, we experience elements of spiritual life and human life. Neither is wrong, so why do they conflict so much?

What do i do?
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post #2 of 10
7/15/02 at 3:15pm
Although it's all too easy giving advice sitting at a computer with no real ramifications to myself.....

I would say that the name of the band is fine. Perhaps there other reasons things aren't happening for you. I believe things "happen" for bands out of sheer luck, just look at some of the acts that have gained prominence in the past few years.

As for what you should do, just go with your heart. If, as you said, you really play for yourselves then do just that. If you were to make changes that resulted in the band being more successful but you ultimately sacrificed the whole reason you got started what's the point?

Hard work and conviction always have their rewards, sometimes they're just not the ones we had in mind so we overlook them.
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post #3 of 10
7/15/02 at 3:36pm
Making things "break" in the music industry are all about luck, timing, and opportunity.

You'll notice that talent is missing from that equation. Obviously, you can look at any music video channel and see that talent, unfortunately, is a marginal part of the equation at best.

So what can you do about the other three more important factors? A good bit, actually.

First...play live. You're doing it now, but book as many dates as humanly possible. And once you have that audience there, no matter how small, KEEP them. Do everything possible to get them on mailing lists. Send freebie CD singles. Get the more enthusiastic audience members to work as part of your promotional "street team." It's fairly inexpensive to get stickers and guitar picks with your name on them (T-shirts are more expensive, but worth it). Get some of this stuff, and BRAND THAT NAME. Make Sacrament, THE BAND, mean something beyond "Sacrament," the word.

Now....on top of that, it's time to be part of a scene. There MUST be other bands you've played with that have similar styles of music that you like. KEEP buddy-buddy with them. Network with all similar bands, and try to stack shows with each other more than you're doing now. Even if they're shows YOU're putting on yourself, just make it happen. Soon, people at these shows will begin to associate you, the name of the band, and your friends with an identifiable scene and sound. Before they come to see you again, they'll know what they're in for, and that cuts down risk for them and makes them more likely to support you.

Now...as far as your style of music. There's nothing wrong with it in the least. but you have to realize that "style" is in the underground at the moment, so it's unlikely that any major or even moderately big independent labels are going to be into you without you showing them that you can do it at first. That means you have to put together a great promo kit, and continually keep local meda updated on what you do. You need a website, and you need to QUICKLY get some musical product out to sell with a UPC barcode number on it. Every time you sell one of these UPC discs in a store on consignment, Soundscan tracks the info. When you begin selling a significant amount of discs and you're not affiliated with management or a label, people BEGIN TO NOTICE. They will come to you. They will do things on your terms.

Basically....you guys must become detectives at this point. Because there are a bunch of future Sacrament fans out there who like the type of music you play, BUT you have to find them and let them know you exist.

Keep at it.
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post #4 of 10
7/15/02 at 3:43pm
Thread Starter 
Micah, thank you so much. I've been trying to do much of what you said, but I never really knew just how important it is until you told me.

We've almost got the CD ready. How do I get a UPC barcode on it?
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post #5 of 10
7/15/02 at 3:57pm
Thread Starter 
Here's what I have going:

A Sacrament mailng list. Small, but growing.

Network with 3 other bands so far. Shadowkast, Stigma, and Harrow.

Great fan interaction.

Complete promotional kit, updated often.

CDs and other merch are on the way.
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post #6 of 10
7/15/02 at 4:08pm
I SWEAR this is not a plug for them, but I put out my CD's with Ampcast.com. If you start up a page there (one-time a year $25 fee), they'll offer you the CD program.

Now you are by no means obligated to sell all your CDs there, BUT if you put up your CD there they'll offer you a UPC barcode for $30-35, I believe. You pay, and then send you a .GIF or .JPEG file. You just need it once, and you can get a physical copy of the CD when you request a free sample CD to approve their work (which you're entitled to).

Once you have that you can send the CD to ANY duplication place, and whenever someone buys your CD from a merchant, it'll register on Soundscan as your band.

Of course, you should be selling a lot MORE CDs at your shows. As I said before...physical product that you either sell or giveaway is PARAMOUNT at this stage in your band's career.

The other stuff sounds great. And I'll remind you that many of the best musical ventures have come as a result of bands being turned away from existing avenues. If you guys aren't getting enough bookings, get together with the bands you're cool with and throw parties in warehouses or wherever you can get the space. Food and drink are powerful magnets.

MAKE YOUR OWN SCENE.

Get a street team. Fast. Put those great fans to work for you, and treat them as extra band members. Give them merch and update them on everything as if they were on drums.

Get up a website, pronto, but only when you have music to download from it. Keep the URL as short as you can (use a redirect service if necessary), and put THAT on all promotional material.

And just keep at it. You'll MAKE your own opportunities.
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post #7 of 10
7/15/02 at 5:57pm
Does your town have a good-sized amount of local rock bands? If so, that's the problem. If the scene is over-saturated with college-aged kids who happen to play music, you'll never be able to get a steady series of gigs. I live in a small town with all of about a dozen or so rock bands, therefore, my band can pretty much get a gig whenever. The only catch with us is that we either get paid a little pocket change, or we don't even get paid at all. We show up, set up, blast out an hour of apeshit cover tunes, and we leave. We do it well, and we always have fun. As far as advice, I really can't say anything better than what Micah said. He hit the nail right on the head.

As far as names go, I like Sacrament, but then again, I'm an old school headbanger. The name reminds me of Testament, Megadeth, and the like. But keep in mind, 80's speed metal is not popular right now. It's one of those genres that constantly retains a very loyal, albeit relatively small fanbase. I'm not saying that you should change your style, in fact, fuck that. But a name with a little more vagueness wouldn't hurt. Getting people to show up is the key; if you can manage that, you've won. Once they've arrived, you can pretty much guarantee that they'll enjoy SOME aspect of it. It's not selling out, and it's not conforming. Your music isn't changing, and neither are your beleifs.

If you do decide to change your name, go with something that sounds menacing, but somewhat unclear. My band is called Destro (Yeah, as in the silver-headed baddie from G.I. Joe). There are people that know the reference and are automatically sold, and there are people who don't realize what it is until they show up and see me holding a big silver head on a stick. And then there's the crowd that never realizes what it means. If you can hook a few with a good name, that at least gets the ball rolling.
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post #8 of 10
7/15/02 at 6:05pm
Almost all the advice I was gonna give you, Mikah already gave (and a lot more). I agree that you just gotta keep looking for places to play, and building up an audience. Once you have the audience, the gigs come alot easier, because the ONLY thing club owners care about is how many people you can bring in.

As for the name and the religous content, Creed are pretty huge right now, and Testament are (were?) a succesful metal band with as close a name to yours as possible. It probably does turn some people off, but if you change your music and then become a success, did you really succeed? You're gonna run into alot of idiots in "the biz" who think they know what people want to hear better than the people do, but the bottom line is this: you know that you would want to listen a Christian heavy metal band, right? That's why you make the music you do. And if you like it, chances are there are other people out there that like it too. Yes, it's gonna take a little longer if you insist on doing it your way, but when you finally get that break, when you finally get the chance to show the world what you got, you're gonna be presenting them with something that's totally you, something that they haven't heard before, and someone, somewhere, will apreciate that.
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post #9 of 10
7/15/02 at 6:51pm
In addition to playing a lot of shows and building up a local following, don't oversaturate in one place. Get out of town as much as you can. Aim for bigger towns, if possible, but even sleepier towns might have a bunch of folks just starving for your type of music. It's hard, it can be frustrating, and you may not make much money off the bat, but it serves two purposes:

The obvious one: You establish a new following and make new connections.

The less obvious one: You don't burn out your local following with three shows a month. Due to some very supportive local clubs, my band kept getting offers to play and we kept taking them. After a while, the dropoff was noticeable - your friends and fans may LOVE your music, but no one can make EVERY show, and, unless you write new material like crazy, there's less reason to come back and see the same show over and over. Depending on the size of your town, you may have also just reached everyone in the niche that wants to hear that type of music.

I'd be willing to bet your name and music aren't the problems. As Micah said, straight-up, non-nu metal is pretty underground at the moment. College kids and labels generally aren't looking for the next Metallica. However, bands forced to work within a niche might find a more dedicated underground audience.

BTW, the religion thing can work for you or against you. There's a huge underground of overt Christian bands of all stripes. On the other hand, bands with pretty devout members, like King's X and U2 made it without exploiting their faiths. Bands who bill themselves "Christian" often come off like they're just using it to market themselves. Bands who simply acknowledge it (whether in the music or not) always seemed classier to me. The music should speak for itself without the addition of "we're a Christian band," or "we're an all-chick rock band," or "we're a white supremacist band" as a marketing ploy to certain niche markets.
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post #10 of 10
7/15/02 at 7:07pm
Thread Starter 
This is so great. I love CHUD.
All of your advice and stories are extremely helpful. I don't feel so overwhelmed now. I was working hard at a lot of the wrong things before, so I now I can start putting my efforts into some things that will more likely pay off.
I appreciate everybody's honesty and respect. Classy folks, you are.
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