Matt's BEAUTY AND THE BEAST review - Page 2

Oh, and the notion that people are to enter into relationships in order to change the other ... that's dangerous, too.

Change may happen ... but only as a by-product. Too many very unhealthy relationships begin and continue based upon the notion that "I can change that person!"

I don't think Belle enters into the relationship to change Beast. She enters into it to save her father.

Also, while it appears that Belle seems interested once she sees the portrait of him as a dashing, young, man, I don't think the argument of she wanting him because he's hot holds up. Gaston is hot (or at least everyone else in the movie thinks so) and she gives him the cold shoulder.

And yes, Beast yells and shouts at Belle, but she stands up to him most of the time. Also, when she's in danger from the wolves, he goes out and protects her. Now you can take that as women can't protect themselves (and they probably can't against a pack of wolves), or you can take it as being there for someone you care about.

Again, I think Blofeld offers up a unique and original opinion; I just don't agree with it.

For the record: I stripped my own bed, so that Mrs. Nunziata didn't have to...

Great review Blofled.

This is a terrible story in a nice package.

Damien, get off your high-horse. Disagree as much as you like. Differences of opinion are welcomed, healthy debate is one of the things this site could use more of, but you insist on taking things to the personal level BECAUSE of your disagreement.

I don't care what other reviewers have to say. I'm not asked by Nick to write reviews for the site because of anyone's opinion but my own. Upon the invitation to write the review, I said I'd have some "ranty" things to say. Nick gave it to me anyway -- and good for him! The last thing this site needs is for someone to regurgitate the popular opinion IF THEY DON'T FEEL THAT WAY.

I stated my opinion. Some people agree, others don't. This thread is a nice change from the standard review responses. But attack the viewpoint, not the viewer, k?

I wanted to lash out last night but i'm finding his point of view very refreshing. I'm personally GLAD now that his opinion is the way it is, because it makes CHUD unique. You guys aren't afraid to tell it like it is.

DAmien leave it alone. It's the man's opinion. He's entitled.

You say your objections are opinions and turn around and say Blofeld's are not?

What exactly did you expect to see going into this Blo? One look at any media on this and you know what every characters role will be, how the story will progress and what the outcome will be. There are no surprises here. The Beast is bad because he was a dick as a kid, got turned into a monster and is repeatedly attacked by local villagers. He is not holding Bells dad for ransom. He is just used to abuse so he throws the cat in prison for disturbing him. Bell shows up, offers a trade the Beast is confused with the way these people are acting so why not. He has her locked up, is unsure what to do, is unacustomed to someone not only being unafraid but challenging him. They both must learn to deal with each other. To compare the Beast to an abusive husband is a little off base, he is just a very mad guy trying to protect himself. To each there own though, I'm more of a Little Mermaid fan myself anyway. Just my two cents.

What does what I expected going in have to do with my final opinion of the film AS IT IS PRESENTED? Of course I could've told you I would find it troublesome prior to viewing. I find that my expectations bear as much weight as the length of my review.

Excuse the Beast his behavior all you want. The fact of the matter is that Belle, as a character, is asked to fall in love with the Beast in spite of his treatment of her -- because SHE CAN CHANGE HIM.

Dangerous.

Who asks her to? Or am I misunderstanding? And the power of unconditional love can change a person. In fact in a way I could see some Christian allegory in this. God loves us even though we are unlovable and redeems us with unconditional love. We are the beast. But that's probably going to deep. wink

Fine that's your opinion. We get it. He doesn't have to explain it to you. Drop it.

I'm sorry. Not clear. The storywriters ask her to take that step.

And she's successful. Granted she loses a really cool castle in the process.

But in life it rarely is successful. The usual result is tragic.

Agreed but this isn't anything even approaching real life. It is a faerie tale. It is Disney's job to tell stories which entertain. They were successful. It is not their job to be social engineers.

In our world, however, far too many people hold to the "fantasy" when it comes to love and romance. I simply do not wish to introduce my daughter to the idea that she should put up with the Beast for the sake of the true spirit within. Instead, she should find a partner who has already developed his sense of kindness and compassion -- link up with that and make a happy life. Why choose the struggle?

That's cool. I respect your opinion and you certainly know your child better than anyone. If you think that this movie will end up putting her in harmful relationships then I understand.

So let me get this straight, Blofeld’s opinion on this is overly harsh for the simple reason that girls are smarter than we think even in their youngest years and this message will not be absorbed say like the thought Calista Flockhart and Kate Moss have the ideal body type as proven by their fairy tales, Barbies, and fashion designers the world over have taught. Deep down they really know this not healthy nor attractive (with the exception of Kirby? and fashion designers) but they do it to make themselves happy and are not unduly influenced by imagery from their childhood or fashion media.

I don't think it's overly harsh I just don't agree with his opinion that the message is even there. Where I see uncondiotional love has the ability to change, he sees love who you are stuck with regardless of how bad they treat you.

Ha! Keller wins the square!

You are still treating this as if Belle was tricked into marriage and them founf out her husband was abusive. The Beast doesn't like her or anyone else he treats people as he has been treated. Belle just shows him that not everybody is so bad, the love story is almost obsolete it is them becoming friends at all that is significant to the moral.

Unconditional love...

Hm.

I certainly have that for my children. My parents. One friend. I had it for my wife, but, alas ... she didn't for me -- or maybe I'm fooling myself, maybe I didn't have it for her (still trying to sort some of those issues out for myself). But Unconditional Love for someone I've never met, and who I meet solely because they've kidnapped my father...

WTF, Blo!

That is one of my favorite Disney flicks!

That was harsh!

But I LOVED the screencaps!

Some of the best yet!

To understand WTF, read the review and this thread.

Let's take a look at my favorite Disney film: The Little Mermaid. In that, Ariel changes herself for love. That is a romantic ideal! Eric is nice to her! WOW! Someone deserving of her self-sacrifice.

The guy was trespassing and got locked up. You make it sound as if the Beast hunted him down and took him. I think even young kids would understand that the Beast is not inherently bad, just doesn't trust people or know how to deal with them anymore. I always thought the Beast locking him up was just a way of showing that this is what everyone expects of him so fine he will act that way.

Right. Okay. It wasn't exactly a kidnapping. It was a man lost in the forest, beset upon by wolves, fleeing for his life behind the safety of the Beast's fence. Looking for help and shelter. Open door. Inviting talking candlesticks, warm fire. Serving him tea out of cups that get tickled by his moustache...

And then WHAM in a locked cellar door.

I thought I did a pretty good job explaining the lock up scenario. Alas I think I'm done defending this movie, The Little Mermaid is a much better film anyway.

Women: you have my permission to fall in love with crack-addicted, alcoholic, assholes. They're good inside. They just need your love.

Thanks for clearing that up for me, Blo!

My favorite Disney Film is the Hunchback of Notre Dame. Even though I haven't seen it in a while, I think that the presents the same story as B&B only closer to the way things SHOULD be, according to Blofeld. I.e., Quasimodo falls in love with Esmerlada because she's nice to me--er, him.

Me, I love it because it's got some of the best action sequences in a Disney film. And that scene where Quasimodo carries Esmerlada in his arms up the cathdreal and cries "Sanctuary" while the camera pulls around...that's fucking GREAT. Fucking GREAT.

And the Kevin Klein-Tom Hulce chemstiry is also fantastic.

But enough about Hunchback.

Most fairy tales (in their original, pure form) involve very dark imagery and usually depict humanity at it's grungiest or most despicable. The Disney-fication of some of these stories tones down the original themes, but sometimes the theme itself is just dark. Such is BATB.

I bought it because I (and my wife) liked it, but it may be off limits to my future children unless I can discuss it with them as they watch.

I agree with Burke here on the whole fairy tales depict humans in proper form.

Plus, Damien Ruud's long post above talks about how Beast comes around once he realizes he is not alone in the world. The song "Something There" even elaborates on this whole story arc. Belle is offended by the harsh attitude of the beast and if you remember the chest of drawers talking to her after he demands she come to dinner and explain Beast's situation. He's angry that he was transformed into a beast, but it was his vanity that put him in his current situation.

So, Ernst, after having read your review and all your comments here on the boards, I am still confused why you are offended by this movie, as it tells a story of true human emotion (including betrayal and desire.)

Because it is reprehensible to encourage the notion in our young women that they should stick by an abusive man due to the mistaken notion that their love can change them.

I loved this movie. I understand where Damien is coming from (great post, btw) and Blofeld makes some very good, though opposing, viewpoints. A two hour movie does not a monster make, but
choosing a lifetime commitment in an effort to change an abusive person is just insane. In the end, it comes down to you give what you can. If they don't snap into reality, move the fuck on. Life's too short. Share it with someone worthy of you. Why little girls are bread to be such nurturers still makes me scratch my head sometimes and want to kick my OWN ass.

If I recall correctly, the transormation of The Beast into a pretty boy was in the original novel. No idea about the abusive behavior though. I certainly never viewed the film that way.

But I wonder Blo, do you allow your daughter to watch Pretty Woman?

Blunt, in regards to abusive behavior, I was referring to his cruelty to everyone around him because he couldn't accept what he had become. I got a little carried away there.

Actually, my comment about the abusive behavior was in regards to Blo's review, I think it's the term he used.

I don't allow myself to watch Pretty Woman.

You should kick your own ass for stating that Paprika Smear made with anything like a good post.

Beauty and the Beast is more flawed than Matt gets close to dealing with.

I've myself have always loved how the kindly townsfolk contribute to that sweet opening number about the really beautiful girl who is fucking weird because SHE READS BOOKS.

Here's an ENTIRE TOWN THAT OSTRACIZES A GIRL SIMPLY BECAUSE SHE CHOOSES TO BE INTELLIGENT!

That's an excellent message...

And I simply adore the notion that Gaston is a comically overbearing Special Ed kid for the entire feature...until such time as the film demands a positively venomous villain in the true Disney mold - then they muss up his hair, slit his eyes, grit his teeth and put a blade in his hands.

Sixty minutes of clueless dork...30 seconds of malevolent psycho - just because we're at the right point in the running time - fucking sloppy.

They did this because they know that, as portrayed in the film, Gaston is stupid - not evil - and if The Beast killed him mearly because he's an out of touch dumbass - then the film would be advocating the death of stupid people -

Which to me personally, IS an excellent message - but if I can't be right for believing so - then Disney can't be right, either.

So they show that he's bloodthirsty in his last few moments, and we have a reason to drop him.

Thing is, we've had a reason to drop The Beast the entire time - but the TABLEWARE keeps telling us that the snarling psycho is just misunderstood!

Fact is, these whimsical, wonderful fables that fill our hearts - and our chidren's hearts - with magic - and teach us all such valuable lessons are only slightly less accurate in their depictions of male/female interraction than fucking porno.

At least in porno, women can often be seen in aggressive, dominant roles. They can somtimes command, demand, or dominate.

Disney girls are always pliant dipshits with pretty hair.

Disney Princesses hope that someday their Prince will come.

Porn Princesses MAKE them.

Oh, and OF COURSE Blofeld doesn't show his TODDLER Pretty Woman, Bluntmatt. Is that Pot Logic, man? How did you make that leap?

Animated fable for children VS. adult themed film about prostitute - yeah, that's not apples and fucking hand grenades, is it?

But back to Rudd-

I am so positively sick of coddling stupid people on these boards and everywhere else. Fuck you if you don't get it. Fuck you if you attack or cast aspersions on one of the good ones.

Matt is one of the good ones, Paprika. Who the fuck are you?

You say it's just his opinion, and in the end it's unimportant?

Well, let's put it to a vote.

All the people here willing to buy the opinion of someone who's lived some shit...who's shared with us a reality and a life and a personal stuggle...who we know puts great thought and wit into his words...who never ceases to be there for the chewers...

...before they buy the opinion of..."some guy" - raise your muthafuckin' hand.

You see mine?

Yeah you do.

The 'Feld's review is dead on, and makes me feel as though I was lenient on my Disney DVD "Classic".

And if you don't like it - tough shit. His is the official CHUD Review. Enjoy.

And Avalon - my riff on your post was the only thing I wrote that was remotely comical there - I just needed an in, and the "kick my own ass" line was cute.

But you're right - a world that breeds Cosmo girls needs to breed them young. If corporate America plants the seeds early, we can engineer Trailer Trash Geisha Girls by the age of twelve.

I've got a niece who's ugly ass, snaggletoothed twat of a mother wants to put in beauty pageants. This pig tells tells a four year old girl that she's GETTING FAT.

In this day, there are still moron moms that tell their daughters to find a rich prince, and don't let go - no matter how poorly he treats you.

Beauty and the Beast is a love poem to every female who's ever uttered the words, "Well, he hits me sometimes - but it's just because he loves me..."

And don't forget the ulterior motive of not being human again unless the Beast finds someone to love them. You could argue Lumiere and company are acting out of purely selfish self-interest.

You'd better make this your sig, because if you don't, I sure as hell will. Brilliant.

Go with it, Poxy.

It is done.

Good God that quote rules.....

Alright, there is a fine line between interesting opinion and full-blown cynicism.

Yes, and the message is "Don't always go with the crowd". We're not supposed to like the idiotic townfolk. It's not like Belle succumbs to their wishes and burns her books.

While I'll agree that the transistion from dumbass to psycho is a bit quick, the film never hides that Gaston is a jerk who likes to kill stuff. Well, when he sees that the woman he wants showing love for what he likes to kill, it's not that big of a jump.

Okay, the tableware has its own selfish motives, but if I was going to be stuck as a the toilet for the rest of my life I'd be telling that bitch to go show that beast some lovin' so I can change back.

You have an interesting logic Pollock. So rather than rent Beauty and the Beast for a child, who I sincerely doubt has this level of perception and world-weary cyncism we have here on the boards, I should rent the young girl porn. At least sometimes the women in porn get to be in control before they take it up the ass. I would much rather have Belle, a girl who has overwhelming kindness, stands up for herself (she does except when she goes rooting through Beast's private things), confident, and follows her own road, be a heroine to a young girl rather than the star of Ass Munchers 5.

Yes, you're very clever and funny. But it doesn't help your argument.

Actually, that's why we have the boards. The man can dislike Blofeld's review as much as he likes (anything personal about Blofeld or anyone else is off limits and he's been called on that). Don't like the fact that people can respond to the "official CHUD review"? Tough shit.

Jason may I shake your hand? That rant was a thing of beauty. And I'm beginning to think that Blo was right, but I don't want to pull a Rath. wink

I didn't think about all of the messages that movie seems to send which J most aptly points out. Course its been a while since I've watched it.

In any case you guys have done a great job of persuasion and Damien has persuaded me that he's an ass. Good night and God bless.

What is pulling a Rath, exactly?