Freddy vs. Jason... vs. Ash?

No.

Man, don't give people ideas.

I agree with much of what was said. I liked "Freddy vs. Jason" but there was clearly a lot misssing as far as the feel for the Elm Street films was concerned. All in all, nobody's perfect and they did a good job but I did feel there was something missing.

As for the idea of Ash being thrown in, I have hated it since I first heard rumors about it. It just doesn't work.

HI STIFLER!

I have nothing further of value to add. Goodnight everybody.

We had a lengthy thread on this subject up back in July or August (when I broke the story here at the Corner). Anybody have a link to it?

Here's the link to the original story which went up the week Freddy Vs. Jason was released theatrically. We were mocked and laughed at for a while, (with denials and "that'll never happen" coming from just about everywhere) but when the smoke cleared and the information we had turned out to be true...nobody seemed to remember where the story had first appeared.

Maybe I'm on my own here, but if done right, I would love to see a movie like that. The main problem is that no matter what type of horror icons they decide to mix and match in a movie together what one person sees as a great idea, is another's nightmare. I think back to when it was announced that Texas Chainsaw was being made into a remake. The only respone that was heard was that it was going to be a complete bomb, and basicly who ever came up with the idea should be killed on sight. What turned out to be the final product became one hell of a good movie. (IMO) Again, I may be one a the few, but I would look foreword to see this.

I would prefer Micheal Myers he is supernatural like Jason and Freddy and if not then maybe Leatherface but then again he is still only human and thus easily dispatched ~

I didn't see this posted in the linked thread...maybe I overlooked it or perhaps it's just old news but I liked what Robert Englund had to say about it...

http://www.joblo.com/index.php?id=2758

"It's a coffin nail -- but it's a great coffin nail, because I love this guy -- Bruce Campbell as Ash, the monster-killer that he played in the 'Evil Dead' movies, coming after Freddy and Jason, getting both of us, and leaving the world safe from sequels."

"It would have to be a phenomenal script. It would have to be Bruce and Sam Raimi locked in a Palm Springs hotel for six weeks. It would be great for him and great for us. We could put the franchises to bed with a big, super, pop-culture, camp epic."

Sounds groovy.

Re: Freddy vs. Jason... vs. Ash?

o_O

You say that as if a large portion of Ronny Yu's work isn't intentional camp and FvJ was unintentionally campy.

As much as I love Englunds idea, I have the feeling the studios wouldn't want to "kill off" Freddy and Jason. Of course they could always bring them back in some goofy way...

I am in complete agreement. Freddy and Jason movies are very similiar in atmosphere, although Freddy got cheesier as time went on. The Evil Dead movies IMO have nothing in common. I guess they would have to make Freddy and Jason into demons for it to make any sense and that would just not be right. Michael Myers thrown in with Freddy and Jason makes a lot more sense, but still not a good idea IMO. I think the next big vs. movie should be Jaws vs. Flipper.

I would be so there! Either that or Jaws vs. Orca.

Any chance to see Ash on screen again is a good one. It could be an Ash palmolive commercial and I would eat it up.

If done right, this could very well work out great.

The only reason I think a lot of people agree on Freddy and Jason being in the same film universe is that fact that, now, they were in a film together. A film that was a lot more Friday the 13th than it was A Nightmare on Elm Street. Freddy was a guest in this universe. Why can't other people be guests at the party?

As far as taking themselves seriously, the first film in each franchise be it Evil Dead, Friday the 13th or Nightmare, all took themelves fairly seriously and then got progressively more ludicrous as the films went on. Evil Dead, although being credited as a funny horror movie, is way more intense than both of the other inaugural films. Friday and Nightmare both seemed to rely more on shock than actual tension. And there are downright comic scenes in all of them. Although, I do agree that Army of Darkness is a comedic fantasy/adventure film rather than an actual horror movie. But, I mean, Freddy tried to have a baby. His bones came alive in one film and picked a man up over his head. The last segment of Freddy's dead was shot in fucking 3D! Jason punched a fucking guy's head off. He smashes a woman's chin in during Jason Goes to Hell and the resulting damage looks like a reject from a Muppet movie. He picks up a girl in a sleeping bag and smashes her against a tree (which, by the way, is the funniest death scene ever). A move that is even parodied in another film in the same franchise.

Ash does belong in more of a screwball comedy with horror elements added in. While Freddy belongs in the horror movie with comedic elements, and Jason belongs in the straight up slasher flick. How can these three personas not fit perfectly, if written well? Just think of it as Dean Martin, Jerry Lewis and their strange, razor fingered, love child. It could be the first 'Bad Guy Buddy Movie'.

The only way I think it could work, though is to get the actual creators of Ash to write it. There has only been one team that's handled Ash. Freddy and Jason, as far as writing goes, can be copied. They are equations. Add a little bit of this, a little bit of that and anyone can write them succesfully. There are only two people who could create another Ash on the screen and have me still respect the character.

Well, since Freddy vs Jason was horrible beyond belief (a matchup 10 years in the making my ass!), Ash would save the next one...


But what a lame idea this is. Once you get past the excitable fanboy hype, it really makes no sense to include Ash, other than a gimmick.


If it took them this long to make a F vs J movie, then imagine the problems they will run into making one with Ash. Either a lame story, or a long time for a good script.

besides, we all know Ash would have to win. They can't kill him off...


Maybe if they do make Freddy vs Jason vs Ash, they can have a clear winner, and not have a cop out ending like F vs J...

Originally posted by brittlebones: I actually felt like it was the other way around. In fact, you're the first person I've heard say that. You didn't feel like it was Jason who was guest starring in an Elm Street movie?

Aside from that, my hatred of FvJ is well-documented, so I'm hardly the guy to ask how he thinks another one might be. (And for the record, I never "wanted" the film to suck, in fact, I thought it might be fun and I was actually looking forward to it before I saw it.) HOWEVER, the more I think about WHAT sucks about FvJ, the more I think the addition of Ash might be something fun. What really sucked about FvJ? The kids, right? Those summer stock, talentless, needlessly plot-involved kids, right?

So, hows about we get rid of them and replace them with Ash?

Man I dont want Ash included, only because Im afraid the studio will ruin the character, make him TOO goofy or too pointless like in FvsJ. Jason was pointless and Freddy was well Freddy from NOES 4-6. The opening scene was the films only saving grace.


Pinhead against those two tired characters makes more sense, if only because he has that same sense "Im too powerful to be real" as the other two.

Now Ash thrown against a pack of lycans and deadites with a unit of British soldiers; in a remote farmhouse sounds awesome

I too felt that this was a glorified Nightmare on Elm Street with Jason as a guest star.

Jason was horrendously under used.

I see what you mean with the whole Jason being the guest thing. I think of it more as Freddy being a guest in the Friday universe, although Jason is the supporting character for the plot. The story is totally Nightmare (with the Hypnocil and the kids in the mental institution and all), but the movie world itself felt more like a Jason flick.

The acting in "Freddy vs. Jason" killed it for me. Everything was so rushed. I think they ignored too much of what made both franchises work. As a movie, it was a good time but I never felt like I was watching a Nightmare On Elm Street movie.

The only way I can see Ash involved is if they just make it a straight-up parody. I also hate the idea of throwing any third character in the mix. They need to stop while they are ahead. Michael Myers?!? Come on.

FvsJvsA

I would really love to see this movie happen.

A Jason vs Ash movie has actually been a fanboy dream of mine since right around the time Peter Briggs did that interview with Fangoria saying he'd be writing and possibly directing FvsJ. So to know that it's actually been talked about is great, and to have Freddy in it as well would just add to the fun.

I think the worlds of Evil Dead, Friday the 13th and Nightmare on Elm Street mesh perfectly, and I could see the character Ash working fine in a movie that's not much more a comedy than FvsJ was (and there was quite a bit of comedy in there.) Ash is only a goofy as the things he has to react to call for him to be, I don't think Freddy and Jason would be doing Three Stooges routines with him. Put the Ash from the end of Evil Dead II when he puts the chainsaw on and goes into the basement, with the fighting skills he shows at the end of AOD, into a movie with the same feel as FvsJ, I think it'd all fit together great.

There's a lot of fun things that could be done with this set up...

I imagine scenes like Ash realizing the boomstick won't work on Jason, Jason tossing Ash around like the hero of Jason Goes To Hell while Bruce makes his "noises of pain", a scene where Ash is stuck between Freddy and Jason and he's armed only with a shovel... and if you've played the game Fistful Of Boomstick, you know he can be a real badass when he's taking on multiple enemies with a shovel. Ah, fanboy dreams.

It'd be the first time Freddy and Jason have ever encountered a real hero, as Inspector said he'd be a huge step up from the teens.

(Though I was very happy with the way FvsJ turned out.)

How about we all settle for FvJ 2 ?

Considering Jason has all but one of the kills in FvJ, I'd say he was used pretty much the whole time.

That's beside the point. The plot, the structure, the kids, the "universe" of the movie is clearly all Elm Street. It's like it's Freddy's world, Jason just kills in it.

I was more intrigued by the idea of Ash being put in the Phantasm world, but since that won't happen I dont know what to think. I mean, anything with more Ash is good, right??? I just want ONE more movie with the Ash character in it...

But then again, I don't need some jackass FvJvA movie fucking up the character.

The problem is that it could've been better. A lot better. There's no rule on the books that said the movie had to be gratingly inept and terribly executed. (And you managed to mention all of the series low points, what about Friday 4: Final Chapter? Jason Lives? Nightmare on Elm Streets 1, 3 and 7?)

This was a chance for New Line to do something fun and exciting and cool with these two horror icons. With 10 years of development, you'd think that was what they holding out for. Instead, we get a piece of shit that barely holds a candle to the worst in each series.

I don't know Inspector. I just viewed New Nightmare for the first time last night after avoiding it like the plauge since it was in theaters, and I have to say. Freddy vs Jason blew that thing out of the water.

I was aching with frustration while watching it.

You're right about FvJ though. However I at least enjoyed it. New Nightmare just hurt my braims.

I can respect that. I don't agree, but I respect the opinion. No fightin' words here.

crap I was looking foward to mixing it up a little.

Big boobs and Big blood. That sooooo needs to be a tagline.

But I think you may have nailed a few of the hight points. Although I'd disagree with you about Jason. He wasn't menacing at all... merely...There.

Yu did all that you said he did.... at least visually anyway, but still... that movie was at the very least two rewrites away from being good. They should have gotten rid of the rediculous Father as murderer subplot at the very least.

But..... and I say this not to insight a fight. But lets talk about the editing and crappy camera work from New Nightmare, Becuase it's still fresh in my mind and FvJ is as well.

Craven's framing is awful and the handheld camera work was just bad. At least Yu has a grasp of composition. Cravens Editing was convoluted as well. While The editing in Yu's wasn't perfect, at least it was somewhat coherent.

Freddy vs Jason was, while waaaay clunky itself... a much smoother flick than New Nightmare.

I wonder if anyone could point out some of the hight points in New Nightmare?

I agree. New Nightmare was a great concept....done very, very badly. After the novelty of hearing everyone address each other by their real names wore off, there wasn't much left. The climax was completely ridiculous and the brat child was annoying as hell. Plus I always knew that Heather Langenkamp was a horrible overactor, but to not even be able to play herself well...damn that's bad. On the plus side, John Saxon owned (but that's a given) and I did like Freddy's new look.

I never said that the acting was phenominal in any of the Nightmare or Friday films but it was acceptable. The actors in those films seem to understand the content and the movies were what they were. It's not just the actors. It's the whole presentation of the characters. They seemed like they were trying to play it a certain way so that even the idiots could understand that it was supposed to be played for laughs. The early films could convey that certain cheesy comedy without making it so obvious.

It's the same problem that I had with "Scream" (only not as drastic). They can't just accept that it's a B horror film. They have to go and try to make some witty little commentary within the film about how cliche things have gotten.

I will say that I enjoyed "Freddy Vs. Jason" but my biggest complaint is that it seemed more like they took characters from a Kevin Williamson 90's slasher than a Freddy or Jason film. Or maybe I'm just getting too old for this shit.

The first hour of F vs. J was pure pain for me. I disagree that the acting has always been bad. There were good actors in some of these movies. Johnny Depp, Laurence Fishburn, even Heather Lagenkamp and Patricia Arquette were way better than any of the people in F vs. J. Yes, the wizard kid in Dream Warriors sucked but there were others in the movie that made it good. I will say that Robert Englund gave it his all and he was one of the few reasons to see the newest entry. I also liked the idea of making Freddy darker again but the creative kills just weren't there.

First of all this movie was pure complete ass. The ONLY redeeming feature was Jason. He was completly and utterly cool. Funny as how I hate the F13th series except for Jason goes to Hell. Freddy wasn't dark at all. If you wanna see the real Freddy Krueger watch the first Nightmare. I was actually embarassed watching this at home. 10 years they've had this in development. If they wanna do a VS movie again, do it without freddy.