Carmelo Anthony vs. LeBron James

If Denver makes the playoffs, I take Carmello.

This one isn't as close as some people make it out - LeBron by a mile.

I've been 'Bron's cheeleader around here, so I'm glad you said it for me. LeBron is the only the third rookie to average over twenty points per game, five rebounds per game, and five assists per game.

The other two: Michael Jordan and Oscar Robertson.

That's your Rookie of the Year.

I don't know if it's that clear cut, especially if Denver makes it to the playoffs. That was the difference last year between Amare and Yao, why would that change this year?

LeBron by a mile! He is definately the better player. Hopefully the Cavs can have some sucesses again next year and reach the playoffs.

If we're predicting the outcome, I absolutely agree that this will be the deciding factor. But in five years, I think people will look back on that vote and wonder how the hell Yao didn't win Rookie of the Year. Amare's a hell of a player, but Yao was more impressive, and is well on his way to being one of the most dominant players in the game.

And if LeBron would've had a healthy Jeff McInnis playing alongside him all year, this year's vote wouldn't even be close.

I don't keep track of these things, but why does a teams success have anything to do with the ROY?

Same reason it has bearing on MVP.

I'm voting for Darko.

2002-2003

Yao Ming

13.5 ppg, 8.2 rpg, 1.7 apg, 1.79 bpg

Amare Stoudemire

13.5 ppg, 8.8 rpg, 1.0 apg, 1.06 bpg

All this with Ming starting from day 1 and Stoudemire not even getting his starting spot until Gugliotta got hurt a dozen games into the season. Why do people still talk about it as if it was an upset? The second half of the season Stoudemire was by far the better player. Oh, and by the way this season they have identical rebounds and Amare is posting 3 more ppg. Don't believe the hype machine, boys.

All that being said, LeBron actually living up to (and exceeding) the absurd hype he had coming into this season cements the award. He's ridiculously good. By age 21 he'll be the best player in the game, all he really needs to do is improve his D a little and cut down on the turnovers (his one true weakness). Carmelo is very good, LeBron is greatness.

Whoa now, value is implied with that award, so at least I understand the reasoning behind reporters judging players by their teams success. Where do people get off associating a players value to his team with the ROY award?

Good centers are always more valuable than good forwards. Therefore if the award is close the center should be given the award due to a higher degree of difficulty.

Center
Point Guard
Power Forward
Small Forward
Shooting Guard

no way. You don't give an award to someone based on position, I don't care how close it is.

We were talking about this in college football season, when people said a wide receiver (Fitzgerald) should get the award, despite being involved in less plays (and is therefore not as important) than a quarterback. Then others said the quarterback was more important due to the importance of the position.

You can't say a center deserves the award due to difficulty of position, you give it to the player who played better overall, regardless of position.

If you believe this, then you have to believe this

Quarterback
Running Back
Wide Receiver
Defensive Specialists (pass rushers, coverage men)
Tight End

Do you believe that?

Everyone believes that. How the hell do you think so many QB's and RB's win the award. You think they're REALLY the best player in all of college football every single year?

As for numbers, both Mello and LeBron led their teams from two of the worst teams in the league to good seasons. Mello led his team to the playoffs for the first time in forever.

Mello: 21.1 ppg, 2.8 apg, 1.2 spg, 6.1 rpg (team: 43-38)

Lebron: 21 ppg, 5.9 apg, 1.6 spg, 5.5 rpg (team: 34-47)

Even on points per game, Lebron gets is on assists, even on steals, Mello on rebounds.

Both players played great and both would be rookie of the year if not for the other. I would say that because of the playoffs, Mello gets the rookie of the year award, although I think Lebron has a bigger future ahead of him.

They could both end up having great careers and I think a natural rivalry between them would be great for the sport (see, Byrd/ Magic, Reggie/MJ, etc...)

Exactly, but that is still not the way it should be. The best playing player should win the award regardless of position. That is what I was saying. I don't care if your a center, forward or guard.

So you think a left guard should win the heisman over a QB?

Wow. Complete and utter insanity. No bearing on reality whatsoever. It has nothing to do with a higher degree of difficulty, it has to do with the genetic lottery involved with being that size. There are very few people tall enough/big enough who are coordinated enough to play in the NBA, and teams are always looking for centers because of this. You're talking about a center who was outrebounded by a power forward. A center is supposed to be under the basket, is supposed to get rebounds.

I say again that in 5 years people won't be raising eyebrows about the Amare selection. If anything he will have reinforced it by then because he seems to be advancing quicker than Yao is and has a better opportunity on a team where he is the man rather than stuck behind a pair of greedy guards who think the team belongs to them.

As I said When I said, center, foreward or guard, you obviouslly think there is a position in football that is called forward. I was taking the discussion back to basketball - where it began. A center (Yao), a forward (Pierce) or a guard (Lebron).

But, no, I don't think a left guard (in football) will be the best player in the nation - but I think a defensive player should be given a chance if they prove they are the best, I feel a wide receiver or tight end should be given a chance.

I guess you believe the Heisman is an award for the best quarterback/running back in the league and no one else is deserving of it?

A good center is more valuable than a good power forward becuase there are plenty more good power forwards than good centers. It's a lot more difficult for me to replace a Yao Ming than it is to replace an Amare Stoudamire. Based on that and the closeness of their stats, I would say Yao deserved the award. It's really not his fault that Francis was a selfish bastard last year.

I would also agree with that NFL list.

Here's one for baseball.

Pitcher (their own category)

Catcher
Shortstop
Second Base
Center Field
Third Base
Right Field
Left Field
First Base

No one argues that ARod was more valuable as a shortstop than a third basemen because it is easier to find someone with his offensive and defensive skills who can play third rather than short. In short, Yao's higher degree of difficulty or greater value should have garnered him the award.

Burke.

I got 4 questions for you.

1. Do you feel pitchers should be eligible for MVP awards or should they only be eligible for Cy Young Awards

2. Do you feel releivers should be eligible for Cy Young Awards even though they have their own Rolaids Relief Award.

3. Do you feel that if a pitcher gets the MVP and the CY Young, it cheapens the CY Young?

4. And do you feel the Rookie of the Year is another Most Valuable Player award or just an award for the best rookie that year?

That's a little bit apples and oranges don't you think... every basketball player at one position is far more similar to another basketball player at another position than a pitcher to a hitter/fielder. But...

1. Yes pitchers should be eligible...

2. Yes relievers should be eligible...

3. Not necessarily...

4. I think ROTY in any sport should go to the best rookie... my criteria includes degree of difficulty. I think centers are more valuable than forwards so if a center and forward have very similar stats one should vote for the center. There's a reason you hardly ever see good rookie point guards or centers but lots of impact rookie shooting guards and forwards. Those positions are easier to play. Same with power-hitting first basemen (though there has been a real dropoff at this position recently)... how much more valuable is a catcher that hits like Mike Piazza over a first basemen that hits like Richie Sexson... their numbers may be similar but the average catcher is a lot worse than the average first basemen.

I'd much rather replace a Kobe than a Shaq... the dropoff is hgher from Shaq to an average center than it is from Kobe to an average shooting guard. How much better was Yao than the average center... how much better was Stoudamire than the average power forward?

I'll take Yao and Lebron.

I'm saying someone who has more of an effect on the game should be given the award. That means QB's and RB's are going to usually be the favorites. Believe me, I cheer for a defensive player to take the award but it's also a media award. What are you going to do?

And Burke is correct. Great power forwards aren't half as important as great centers.

Are you talking about the fantasy league MVP? Because really that's what it looks like. In reality, playing a difficult defensive position comes into play almost not at all in regards to the MVP Race. A-Rod happened to be the best SS in the league (and quite possibly of all time), but his value is not diminished in the slightest in the real world because he's playing a new position.

Yao's degree of difficulty was not greater than Amare's. I say again, scarcity of a genetic specimen does not make somebody a better player. Who was the better player? Last year, it was Amare. This year, it's Amare. Quit buying into the hype, Yao is a fun player but he's insanely overrated at the moment. Amare came out of high school, played as the 3rd and 4th option on a team, played significantly less minutes the first half of the season and still put up comparable stats. You have to be willingly blind to miss that.

So great centers are automatically better players than superior power forwards? They should just stop the MVP and ROY ballots, you two guys have it figured out. I'm casting my vote for Shaq, or Yao. I'm trying to figure out which one to give it to. I'm also planning on making one of them my ROY as well.

The key word is "comparable" A-P. Michael Jordan played the least valuable position on the floor but his performance made him an easy MVP candidate and multiple winner. He was head and shoulders above everyone else. If I compare Amare and Yao I see very similar stats. There has to be some way to differentiate them so I would personally go with more valuable/difficult position.

ARod's value in the real world is diminished, at least according to HOF voters. Why do you think Piazza has stayed a catcher for so long? Chipper Jones was a HOF lock at third, now not so much in LF. We're just comparing players to their peers here right. Yeah, if ARod played the outfield he'd still be the best player in baseball. But it would be damn close. There'd be no argument if someone had Barry or Vlad as a better player than ARod. But add in ARod's fairly decent defense at one of the two hardest positions to play on the diamond and there is no question that he is the best player in baseball. Moving short to third isn't a huge deal but there's a reason baseball minds always want to be strong defensively up the middle; it's because the corner infielders and outfielders don't make much of a difference defensively even if they're the best at their position.

Who are the greatest power forwards in the history of basketball & who are the greatest centers? It's not automatic, but it's pretty close.

I'd actually really like to see a list of the greatest power forwards of all time.

It should come as no surprise that I agree with Marc Stein and David Aldridge. That said, he makes a compelling case.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/column...arc&id=1782004

I don't know about all-time, but current power forwards include Tim Duncan, Kevin Garnett, Chris Webber, Dirk Nowitzki, Jermiane O'Neal. I think that power forwards are much more relevent in todays game than centers, as there as so few great centers, and many teams today are counting on power forwards to get more of the rebounds that used to belong to centers.

That's actually an even stronger point for great centers.

Garnett and Nowitzki are small forwards. Jermaine O'Neal is a center.

I was just looking for power forwards, and I pulled the names from Sportsline, which listed them as power forwards.