NON-SPOILER "Revenge of the Sith" Discussion

Oh God, thank you!

Those images were weakening my resolve to TRY and go into ROTS non-spoiled. I am a weak-minded sort of fellow.

Does anyone here think the prequels could have worked as longer films, say 3 hours each? It would have fit more stuff in, and perhaps given them more 'artistic' cred, something the LOTR films seem to have.

I would really like to see how this thread develops.
I'm spoilered up, so i won't post anymore, but i do not want to see anyone screwing it up.

it will interesting to see if anyone on these boards is 'non-spoilered' on this film.

Anakin Skywalker becomes Darth Vader.





....My bad.

Thats ok. As long as Threepio doesn't turn out to be built by Anakin or anything...

Complaining about spoilers in one thread, and actually doing something about it by creating a non-spoiler thread...BRILLIANT!!!

And now for my 300th post. Trying to find a non-spolier angle to discuss ROTS, I guess the easiest thing is to ask is - is it any good? What has been the buzz coming out of the Ranch? Has anybody seen a lot of the movie and offered any comments about the pacing, acting, dialog? Sure, it's probably not even close to finished yet, but what's the buzz from people who are in the know? I'm sure this can be discussed without any spoilers. I remember the buzz from AOTC was fairly positive. Is there a more accurate sense of what we can expect in May, knowing that the spoilers are looking very good?

There, I've contributed.

Hey...I guess I'll post here...as I cannot post in the Crispy Anakin thread, which is the only one that matters in my opinion, thats where all the cool pics are.

EDIT: I'm a weak willpowered bastard when it comes to spoilers, so don't take offense to this.

Anyone remember when that guy from TIME magazine said AOTC was better than Spiderman? I have learnt not to trust reviews...

I never trusted reviews before that, and sure as hell not after. I say go see the damn movie yourself and decide, if you really need someone to tell you whether it was good or bad, the odds are you should not be seeing a movie at all without mommy's supervision. Critics piss me off to no end!

I wonder what they'll say about ROTS? Critics sometimes have a sheep mentality, where if they see others rubbishing a movie, they will too regardless of what they actually think.

What pisses me off about some critics is that they wield influence, and a lot of people follow them, to the extent that they can affect a films performance purely out of whim.

I think ROTS will get good reviews based on its effects, and the fact that its the last one.

It would have fit more stuff in, and perhaps given them more 'artistic' cred, something the LOTR films seem to have.

Anyone remember when that guy from TIME magazine said AOTC was better than Spiderman? I have learnt not to trust reviews...

And with that, the thread starts out like crap.

I recall they made music videos for Duel of Two Fates and Across the Stars that debuted on MTV right before the movies came out. Will they be doing this for episode 3 as well , and has there been any word on when it will debut?

And it is, Spidey 1 it's awful, I haven't seen it since opening day. Only bits and pieces when it comes on cable.

Now Spidey 2 is tied with X2, as the best comic book movie ever made.

That's a big insult to Spider-Man 2. X2 is not very good.

Back to Star Wars, at this point I'll be happy as long as the big duel is cool. Anything beyond that (be it space battles, better drama, etc) will just be icing on the cake.

Great idea with the non spoiler thread!

I often find myself out of depth in Star Wars discussions as they are always full of people who know the full plot to the new film and how can you speculate with someone that acutally knows?

Anyway Im not by any means a Lucas hater or defender so i just hope we all get the film we have wanted since the Phantom Menace was anouced.

I wonder if the fact that it's opening Cannes has any bearing on Lucas' expectations of how it'll be received.

May 11th. Eight days before the flick opens.

I don't think they would have worked any better, George Lucas would have probably filled them up with more politics. Also star wars has always been 2 or so hours and it always seems enough really, even though some new added scenes on the OT would be fun lol By making it longer wouldn't really give it more artistic cred, LOTR has always had more to fit in though with the books being so long and all.

So i guess on May 11th there will be a few reviews getting out on the film. I don't mind critics too much, it's always accompanying to see there views on the bad/good. It never usualy changes my mind on if i'm going to see the film too much if i'm not already hyped for it. I love the reviews on CHUD, entertaining to read and not at all snobbish as some reviews feel on other sites.

MAY COULDN'T COME FAST ENOUGH!!

I already have the lowdown on Episode IV!

It's about Obi-Wan's quest to discover the fabled Khyber crystal, the only artifact that can stop Darth Sidious. And he falls in love with a female Jedi who turns out to be a Sith.

I got it from a guy called Supershadow, who appears to be a member of Lucas' inner circle.

OMG! That sounds better then episode 3, George Lucas is a genius!

The only thing that disappoints me about ROTS, is that it will make the other two prequels look like shit. I mean if they were all like TPM, then we would see this one and say yay whatever.....But now we have something super great that will cast a shadow on the other two. I really wish they would go back and "fix" TPM, and AOTC.

Wishful thinking, yes. But everyone can dream righ? Oh well, after I see Episode III I'll be to happy to give a shit anymore!

No I have not seen it (but god do I wish). But from what I have seen in spoilerdom, compared to what I saw for the other two...this one will kick both their asses. George Lucas is not an idiot, he knows fans were not happy with the last two, and this being the last one, he nor ILM will disappoint. Have you seen the CG? Have you seen the webdocs? Did you see the trailer? Dude, this will be better than the other two, if not the best movie ever (in my opinion).

Re: reviews

I don't think it's possible for some critics to give movies like Star Wars a good review, because they always critique based on an arbitrary but inflexible personal standard regarding film. I'm thinking of the "cultured" critics like A. O. Scott and company. Some venerated film critics, like Roger Ebert, have a more open-ended perspective and review movies based on the perceived intent of the filmakers, whether it is to be thought-provoking or simply entertaining, or even to horrify or confuse.

I think Ebert will give ROTS a positive review based on its own merits, if the buzz about its quality holds true. But many will not, and cannot, and they are generally the types who never accept a comic-based or similar film as a valid form of entertainment. And the sheep mentality is a reality among critics, especially regarding Star Wars, which has a bad reputation. I predict ROTS will get some bad reviews from close-minded critics who are afraid of losing credibility.

Still, I think in the end the majority will be positive. It will probably rate "fresh" on Rotten Tomatoes, to say the least.

The plethora of licenses granted, the Cannes opening, the Vader-centric campaign et al, makes me think that Lucasfilm desperately wants Soth to become the highest grossing prequel. I wonder if they'll open relatively small (for a blockbuster of this size), like they did with the previous ones or go for broke and aim for highest opening ever.

Not to mention that publishing the novel and the script almost two months earlier is an indication that they are confident that the story is solid.

They did that with the previous two movies.

Hasn't Lucas been saying forever that he figures Ep 3 will make the least money?

At least this time they got a decent writer for ROTS. Stover is miles ahead of Brooks and Salvatore. Carl, I think you've mentioned getting a peek at the script, but have you been given any exceprts of the novelization?

Yes, but McCallum clearly thinks otherwise and I think he has a point. Remember that originally Episode III was supposed to be more low-key with fewer action sequences. After Episode II Lucas changed direction and decided to include as much of the Clone Wars as he possibly could.

"After Episode II Lucas changed direction and decided to include as much of the Clone Wars as he possibly could."
Which is my biggest fear about Ep3 from the spoilers....that there is so much action that the characters and the tragedy of the story will be lost in between the light saber duels. This, IMHO, is the biggest mistake that Lucas could make in the editing room.

While it's true that Lucas has repeatedly stated he believes EP3 will make the least of the SW films, he also said this...


Which could very well be prescient.

I can't believe people still haven't figured out what Lucas is doing with the prequels. He's making a tone poem. He's making a visual map of his own progression as a man/filmmaker pre Star Wars.

TPM - upbeat, adventurous (Modesto - car racing days)

AOTC - mysterious, romantic (USC - falling in love with filmmaking)

ROTS - extreme, crystalizing (Hollywood - nightmare of Star Wars Ep.4 development/production)

As Anakin develops/matures, he develops/matures. They go through the same progressions. Even Lucas himself said he sort of went to the dark side after Star Wars. Became an Empire.

It's brilliant.

You're joking, right?

YesNoYesNo

so that's a no?

People shouldn't fear spoilers. George still has three months or so of editing to do. Most of them will no doubt hit the cutting room floor.

This is a badly needed thread for those who aren't die-hard Star Wars geeks.

The only expectations I have for this are that it will be better than TPM and AOTC. It might even (gasp) be a good movie.

Theory-time:
I think that LOTR has changed everything from a filmmaker's perspective. Jackson has shaken up the ranks of the whole upper echalon of big budget action directors. And I think Lucas has digested it (whether he'd admit to it or not,) even if ROTS was always going to be dark and serious.

Look at the shake out: Cameron announces he's going to make a sci-fi film in response to ROTK, after basically retiring from Hollywood. Spielberg adapts a nearly untouchable literary classic that goes against his old ethos (no evil aliens) although he's been heading that way for the past few years. Lucas decides to be a bit braver and riskier with his creative choices (this is based on stuff i've gleaned from the SW rumors.)

I think that LOTR has shown everyone that you can make an action-filled genre epic without sacrificing character, pacing, drama, darker themes and any other seriousness, and have it be successful .

Getting back to Lucas.... Maybe Lucas senses the creative leeway he now has, due to an audience that has fully digested LOTR. Isn't part of the reason he's made such bad choices in the past is because he thought that the audience wants a "roller coaster ride?" I think that things might have changed since he made that statement. Thing besides the critical drubbing and fan backlash that the prequels have deservedly gotten.

This almost deserves its own thread. The only reason I didn't start one is cause LOTR fatigue is in full effect.

Good points man. I hope its not a case of 'too little too late', where ROTS is concerned.

I had high hopes of ROTS until yesterday, when I sat down to watch AOTC for the first time in ages. I didn't last long. It was so goofy, with paper-thin characters and cartoonish effects. For along time I considered it better than TPM, but not now. And that concerns me. Regardless of how ROTS turns out, I don't like the first two, so I'm already depressed.

LOTR had the advantage of being a great book of huge detail. There was little Jackson had to do to make the films work (but he did it brilliantly). One area where I think Lucas has struggled is in striking the right tone for his prequels. They skew far too young. As LOTR proved, kids can handle rougher stuff. If ROTS is as dark as I hear then it will seem like he's gone from one extreme to the other. We'll see I guess.

I'm looking forward to ROTS (that cautious optimism). I'm a hardcore Star Wars geek, but my expectations have been lowered. However, I don't want any spoilers. I think that spoilers do just that...spoil. I'm sure everybody has heard about the soundtrack for TPM having a track called "Qui-Gon's Noble End". I read that in the newspaper about a week before Episode 1 came out. As a result, Qui-Gon's death didn't hit me as hard as it could have. I went into Episode 2 not knowing a thing, and it was more enjoyable. I mean, it's still weaker than the original trilogy. But I didn't think it was terrible. I think spoilers can diminish a film's impact, and because of that people will have lower opinions of that.

That was my long winded way of saying that I appreciate having a non-spoiler thread.

"I think that LOTR has shown everyone that you can make an action-filled genre epic without sacrificing character, pacing, drama, darker themes and any other seriousness, and have it be successful .

I agree. It must have sent shockwaves to Lucas,Cameron and Speilberg when a comparetively unknown from New Zealand, who reputation pretty much rested on one low budget indie film ("Heavenly Creatures") came along and beat the Hollywood giants at their own game...and did something that none of them could do...make a Sci Fi/Fantasy film that broke the Award Barrier and took home a great many Best Picture awards, including the Oscar. Even Speilberg and Cameron had to leave the genre to win their Director Oscars.
Competition is always good for the creative juices.

I just want the compelling story I've been reading about for the last 25 years.

I want the important questions answered. Basically, the prequels have been, who does what to whom and why? Why does Anakin turn? Is Padme an instigator or a victim of his rage? Does Anakin literally die as latest version of Jedi suggests and why does Obi Wan choose "Ben" for an alias? Why didn't he change his last name? WHat is the fate of Jar Jar Binks?

"WHat is the fate of Jar Jar Binks?
A Slow, Horrible, and Painful Death, hopefully, but with a PG-13 rating, not gruesome enough for me....

I've been avoiding all prequel news for fear of spoilers, but has it been confirmed to have a PG-13 rating? All of the others have just been PG.

Officially, no. But Lucas and other higher ups have said this is the darkest, most violent part of the saga, lots of people die and it's a downer ending, so even though it's not rated yet they're working with the mentality that they're going to get a PG-13 and running with it.

I don't give a shit how dark this movie will be, what i want is some great acting and the story told in a compelling way. ROTS could be dark, have Mace have his head sliced off and then his brains smeared over Jar Jar and an Ewok made to kill himself with a lightsaber but that doesn't make a better movie. Ok totaly pissing about there, i know what you mean by the darkness. I do think though that this movie will deliver the acting, i've enjoyed Ewan through out all the films and think he's been brilliant. If thats done well, with the action being as good as hyped then this could be a pretty awesome episode.

Hmmm....sounds good to me.