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John Hammond is so unrealistic

post #1 of 72
Thread Starter 
"My theme park is not just for the super rich. Everyone in the world will be able to see these attractions."

Yeah, not likely John. You're going to make it economically feasible for the average Joe to come to an island 53 miles off the coast of Costa Rica that is accessible by helicopter only? Good luck making that trip affordable.

Not to mention sheer capacity issues of the park. A average theme park can turn a healthy profit with a admission of $50 or so because they see an average of 1,000+ customers PER DAY. How are you going to get all those people out to the island? Using helicopters that only carry about 6 people, that would take nearly 200 daily flights back and forth between the mainland. Hell, even if you charged $100 a day it wouldn't begin to cover the helicopter service costs alone. Not to mention the general upkeep and research costs of the park.

Of course, even if the park did have a large capacity, there's very little for the guests to do when they aren't on the tour. The museum and tour of the main facility is about the only other attraction, and guests will likely get restless waiting for their turn to take the main jeep ride (of which the flaws Malcom pointed out flawlessly. What happens when you get a bunch of angry tourists demanding their hundreds of dollars back because they didn't see a T-Rex?)

Face it John, given the extreme isolation of the park and it's likely enormous operating costs, the only economic feasible option is Gennaro's plan of "$10,000 per day." Sure, you were planning on opening the second park in San Diego, but that didn't really pan out, did it?

Face it, your original plan sucked and its no wonder InGen booted you from the head of the company.
post #2 of 72
He wasn't such an altruist in the book, was he? Been a while since I read it, but I seem to remember him basically saying "too bad, poor kids."
post #3 of 72
The poor guy couldn't even decide if he was Scottish or English. Cut him some slack.
post #4 of 72
Sea World's dolphin encounter attraction is probably a better comparison. The fee there is somewhere north of $500, and Sea World touts it as "affordable." The wealthy often have no concept of what is or isn't affordable to the average Joe, and so Hammond's speech makes sense in that regard. And I always figured actual guests would be ferried by boat once the park was operational, not by helicopter.
post #5 of 72
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PodBayDoor
He wasn't such an altruist in the book, was he? Been a while since I read it, but I seem to remember him basically saying "too bad, poor kids."
He's a big asshole in the book who hates Tim and Lex. Though I can't really blame him, seeing as they inadvertantly are the cause of his demise.

The best thing I remember about the book is it had a whole lot more death than the film.
post #6 of 72
Of course it wouldn't work. The entire incident was actually engineered as an insurance scam. Only the lawyer knew the truth and Hammond made sure he wouldn't be able to spill the beans.
post #7 of 72
Right. Hammond was an evil corporate figure in the novel and he died a grisly death at the end of the book as well.

What's your take on the LW novel guys?
post #8 of 72
He didn't care, he was getting enormous kickbacks from the World Amber Manufacturers and Marketing Association (WAMMA!)
post #9 of 72
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by gumble2gumble
Right. Hammond was an evil corporate figure in the novel and he died a grisly death at the end of the book as well.

What's your take on the LW novel guys?
Better than the movie.

"Oh hey, guess what everyone? Dinosaurs exist! But we're going to leave them on a island and not bother them or study them at all because they should be left in peace and everyone is absolutely okay with that."

"Hey, Nick, what are those?"
"The bullets from that hunter guy's gun."
"The ones he was going to shoot the T-Rex with?"
"Yep."
"The T-Rex that destroyed the camp, killed about 8 guys, and drove the rest into the raptor field to their grisly deaths?"
"Yep."
"Wow! You're a hero because you place the life of an artificially engineered creature over 2 dozen of your fellow man, most of whom likely have families who will now become destitute."
"I'm a man of peace."
post #10 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Werbal_Kint
The best thing I remember about the book is it had a whole lot more death than the film.
Yeah, I was disappointed that all the dino mauling didn't make it on screen.
post #11 of 72
Did the LW novel have a 13 year old gymnast kick a raptor out the window?
Cause that was awesome.
post #12 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Werbal_Kint
Dinosaurs exist!
That's the only information needed when thinking about these movies.
post #13 of 72
The Lost World novel DID have Zombie Ian Malcolm as its main character.

I guess that's a plus. I wish I could die at the end of the first book, then come back in the sequel as the star.
post #14 of 72
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Did the LW novel have a 13 year old gymnast kick a raptor out the window?
Cause that was awesome.
No, it pretty much had Tim and Lex clones. I forget the girl's name, but the boy's name was Arby and he was a computer wiz (geewillikers, what a novel idea.)

Chricton also reversed several decisions from the first book. Malcom, who died in the JP novel, is revived for TLW and the T-Rex's vision is no longer based on movement for reasons I don't quite remember.
post #15 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Werbal_Kint
...the T-Rex's vision is no longer based on movement for reasons I don't quite remember.
He got contacts.
post #16 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Whitehead
He got contacts.
That's how he got a bigger slice of the residual profits, too.

T-Rex is connected.
post #17 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Werbal_Kint
"My theme park is not just for the super rich. Everyone in the world will be able to see these attractions."

Yeah, not likely John. You're going to make it economically feasible for the average Joe to come to an island 53 miles off the coast of Costa Rica that is accessible by helicopter only? Good luck making that trip affordable.
Actually I seem to remember their being a pier in the movie. Never read the book, but there was a big to do about a pier and missing a boat, so they could have done a carnival cruise type thing which happen to be affordable to most average people. Not like, homeless but almost everyone I know has gone on at least one cruise.. so airfare and then a cruise, not that unlikely someone could afford that at least once in their life.
post #18 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Whitehead
He got contacts.
or Lasick
post #19 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Werbal_Kint
T-Rex's vision is no longer based on movement for reasons I don't quite remember.
No reason is given if I recall correctly, someone does the freeze thing and someone else says "nope, that doesn't work anymore" and freeze guy dies, I think.
post #20 of 72
Hey, anybody investing his money with Hammond's project as described in the book and movie are fucking crazy if they expect to see it back.

No way Jurassic Park could turn a profit in the real world. It is simply too expensive for the bulk of the population, and those who can afford it are too limited a base.
Read the SST Concorde: A plane so expensive to ride in that it becomes a status symbol rather then a real method of transportation and in the end that is not enough to make it profitable.
post #21 of 72
THE LOST WORLD may be Spielberg's most political film... it's basically a 2-hour PETA/Greenpeace infommercial.
post #22 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by dudalb
Hey, anybody investing his money with Hammond's project as described in the book and movie are fucking crazy if they expect to see it back.

No way Jurassic Park could turn a profit in the real world. It is simply too expensive for the bulk of the population, and those who can afford it are too limited a base.
Read the SST Concorde: A plane so expensive to ride in that it becomes a status symbol rather then a real method of transportation and in the end that is not enough to make it profitable.
The park is a bad idea from a financial standpoint. But, you could ship a few dinos to a park in a more accessible and touristy location. Like Cabo or South Padre Island. Build a hotel and spa right next door. Sell time shares. It's all about franchising.
post #23 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Werbal_Kint
Chricton also reversed several decisions from the first book. Malcom, who died in the JP novel, is revived for TLW and the T-Rex's vision is no longer based on movement for reasons I don't quite remember.
I remember being really pissed off and confused by the return of Malcolm. It just didn't make sense.

There was some asshole scientist character who, while observing the T-Rex, has an internal monologue where he poo-poos Grant's vision-based-on-movement theory for no reason. I think he believes the T-Rex was confused by the rain.
post #24 of 72
I don't think anyone actually escaped a T-Rex in the first book by freezing, though. It was a theory. The movie made it an applicable preventative solution to being bitten in half. In the second book, some dude called bullshit, and yeah, I think he mentioned that movement-based vision would make rain-hunting a tad impossible and confusing. Plus he said that the T-Rex's smell would take care of the nonexistant problem anyway, since they have awesome noses or something. I loved the Lost World book. The chameleon dinos were super rad, and there was no Nick Van Owen. Plus the part where little Arby is watching the raptor shaking the dude's (I think it was King) severed head back and forth, then bending down and eating the guys chocolate bar was one of the most horrific images my little 11-year-old ass had ever imagined. They're fun reads now, but their GREAT reads for a kid around 6th grade with a slightly above-the-norm reading level.

On a separate note, the fact that kids in my elementary thought I was super smart because I read Crichton novels makes me sad. I wasn't a genius. I think that kids are just stupider now.
post #25 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by UserNameIndeed
The chameleon dinos were super rad, and there was no Nick Van Owen. Plus the part where little Arby is watching the raptor shaking the dude's (I think it was King) severed head back and forth, then bending down and eating the guys chocolate bar was one of the most horrific images my little 11-year-old ass had ever imagined. They're fun reads now, but their GREAT reads for a kid around 6th grade with a slightly above-the-norm reading level.

On a separate note, the fact that kids in my elementary thought I was super smart because I read Crichton novels makes me sad. I wasn't a genius. I think that kids are just stupider now.
I totally agree those were my fave moments from the LW novel as well. And I too got that type of attitude from my elementary school classmates that I was some geeky nerd for reading Crichton novels.

Speaking of which, Congo was a novel I read during '95 to coincide with the movie release that summer. Remember that movie guys? I enjoyed the film then and while I don't consider it to be *passable* as a film now, it's a watchable diversion and funny to see Ernie Hudson talk in a British accent.
post #26 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl Cunningham
THE LOST WORLD may be Spielberg's most political film... it's basically a 2-hour PETA/Greenpeace infommercial.
If that Harry Knowles looking motherfucker loved animals so much, why did he freak out when the snake fell on him? I mean that guy was more afraid of snakes than hungry dinosaurs.
post #27 of 72
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobClark
If that Harry Knowles looking motherfucker loved animals so much, why did he freak out when the snake fell on him? I mean that guy was more afraid of snakes than hungry dinosaurs.
I think it was just Spielberg showing his disdain for anyone who wasn't an eco-terrorist, which, lets face it, the heroes of TLW are.

Every single death in TLW (with the exception of the San Diego stuff) is the result of Sarah and Nick's bungling and interference - they free the dinosaurs at the hunter's camp, they bring the baby T-rex to the trailer which gets Eddie eaten, and Nick swipes Tembo's elephant gun bullets allowing dinosaurs to yet again destroy the hunter's camp.

They're actually pretty cold-blooded assholes when you think about it.
post #28 of 72
Agree with UserName about the LW book. Loved those dinos and the motorcycle/raptor chase.
post #29 of 72
Not to mention the unnecessary predators. Did that asshole hammond think that bringing back to life a bunch of herbivore dinos was not a big enough pull for tourists? Okay, clone a T-Rex but raptors? What's next, a theme park ride to rape-land?
post #30 of 72
Isn't there a scene in the LW movie where Ludlow is having a video conference call with the investors, describing what a park in San Diego will look like? He even has a little diorama of it. Then Sarah and Nick release the dinos from the cages, and all of that gets fucked up when the dinos stampede the camp.

It's been so long since I read the LW book, I don't remember whether that was in it or not. I just remember reading it, then going to see the movie with my wife, and at the point that the boat crashes into the pier, and they release the T-Rex, I looked at my wife and said, "Ok, they just totally left the book in the dust with this shit."
post #31 of 72
Whatever you may feel about Hammond, the fact remains that he could break you, mate, in two
pieces over his knees, you know it, he knows it. He could buy you six times over. He could dump the stock just to burn your ass!!
post #32 of 72
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martianman
Isn't there a scene in the LW movie where Ludlow is having a video conference call with the investors, describing what a park in San Diego will look like? He even has a little diorama of it. Then Sarah and Nick release the dinos from the cages, and all of that gets fucked up when the dinos stampede the camp.

It's been so long since I read the LW book, I don't remember whether that was in it or not. I just remember reading it, then going to see the movie with my wife, and at the point that the boat crashes into the pier, and they release the T-Rex, I looked at my wife and said, "Ok, they just totally left the book in the dust with this shit."
I think the books probably make mention of a second park, but not anything specific.

Speaking of the San Diego attack scene, it makes no fucking sense. How did the T-Rex, a fucking HUGE dinosaur manage to kill all of the hands on the boat, including the captain and others secure in the pilothouse? They show a hand hanging off the throttle but it's IMPOSSIBLE that the Rex could have eaten that person because it was INDOORS and there seemed to be no damage to the building at all.

There are enough errors between the first two films alone to fill up two whole trilogies of movies.
post #33 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Werbal_Kint
Speaking of the San Diego attack scene, it makes no fucking sense. How did the T-Rex, a fucking HUGE dinosaur manage to kill all of the hands on the boat, including the captain and others secure in the pilothouse? They show a hand hanging off the throttle but it's IMPOSSIBLE that the Rex could have eaten that person because it was INDOORS and there seemed to be no damage to the building at all.
Yeah, that part annoyed me as well. And how did he do all of that, and still get trapped down in the hold, especially if he killed everyone on board? Honestly, at first I thought they were making that part the cut in to the 3rd movie...that something else had gotten loose on the boat, killed those guys, then jumped off into the water. But that would've been too logical, wouldn't it?
post #34 of 72
Thread Starter 
Boat crews seem to suffer mysteriously brutal, yet physically impossible deaths in the JP movie world.

Like the parasail boat crew at the beginning of JP3. They go the the cloud bank, the boat shakes a little bit, and suddenly the crew is totally gone. No screaming, no roaring, no copious amounts of blood and organs.

And made moreso mysterious by the fact that they were about 25 feet away from the shore.

Quoth Hermes "That just raises further questions!"
post #35 of 72
I believe there was mention made of a "coupon day".
post #36 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Werbal_Kint
I think the books probably make mention of a second park, but not anything specific.

Speaking of the San Diego attack scene, it makes no fucking sense. How did the T-Rex, a fucking HUGE dinosaur manage to kill all of the hands on the boat, including the captain and others secure in the pilothouse? They show a hand hanging off the throttle but it's IMPOSSIBLE that the Rex could have eaten that person because it was INDOORS and there seemed to be no damage to the building at all.

There are enough errors between the first two films alone to fill up two whole trilogies of movies.
He had a gun.

You just didn't see it. They edited it out and replaced it with a walkie-talkie.
post #37 of 72
A laser gun that disintegrates everything but left arms.
post #38 of 72
Right.
post #39 of 72
Thread Starter 
Heh. Coupon day.

"I have a coupon for $9,941 off admission. Does that include the helicopter ride too?"
post #40 of 72
"Huh? Not good on Fridays? Where does it say.... oh, crap. Here. Just take it out of my Visa then. Shit."
post #41 of 72
NOTE: Jurassic Park Dino Dollars have no monetary value.
post #42 of 72
Loving this thread.
post #43 of 72
But the most important question regarding Jurassic Park has got to be:

Where the FUCK did that cliff come from!!!??? One minute the T-Rex busts a hole in the fence and comes through, then he pushes the car through the SAME hole and theres a big fucking drop there!! Right where the goat was standing.

Also, had to laugh at Sam Neills ridiculous 'dinosaur call' up the tree. What was that, a fart sound?!

"What have they got in there, King Kong?" WTF!!?? You already SAW the big fucking dinosaur! What the hell do you THINK is in there, Kirstie Alley?!!!

Carry on.
post #44 of 72
Thread Starter 
Not to mention an equally impossible physical displacement at the same Rex paddock later in the film.

Malcom: "Oh shit, I can feel a T-Rex coming UP THE ROAD. I am in the jeep UP ON THE ROAD and I am alarmed because that means the Rex is getting closer to where I am ON THE ROAD."

*jump cut to shot of Malcom waving Ellie and Muldoon to hurry up*

Malcom: "WHOOP! Holy shit we gotta go! Good thing I used my mind powers to teleport myself and the jeep down to the bottom of the cliff where Ellie and Muldoon were! Now we'll drive back to the visitors center, but beats me how we get there, seeing as how we are now INSIDE the T-Rex paddock and not on the main road."
post #45 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeviatedPrevert
But the most important question regarding Jurassic Park has got to be:
Where the FUCK did that cliff come from!!!??? One minute the T-Rex busts a hole in the fence and comes through, then he pushes the car through the SAME hole and theres a big fucking drop there!! Right where the goat was standing.
That's my favorite JP problem, too. It's a shame that they didn't put more thought into some of these things, because they really distract me from a movie with some really great stuff in it. Though the scene that makes me cringe is the one with the over-bemakeuped fat kid that Sam Niell attempts to humiliate.
post #46 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeviatedPrevert
"What have they got in there, King Kong?" WTF!!?? You already SAW the big fucking dinosaur! What the hell do you THINK is in there, Kirstie Alley?!!!
Did you really not get the joke? I mean it was pretty obvious what Malcolm was referring to. The gate leading into the park...it resembles the gate in King Kong that protects the native's village on skull island.
post #47 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Werbal_Kint
Not to mention an equally impossible physical displacement at the same Rex paddock later in the film.

Malcom: "Oh shit, I can feel a T-Rex coming UP THE ROAD. I am in the jeep UP ON THE ROAD and I am alarmed because that means the Rex is getting closer to where I am ON THE ROAD."

*jump cut to shot of Malcom waving Ellie and Muldoon to hurry up*

Malcom: "WHOOP! Holy shit we gotta go! Good thing I used my mind powers to teleport myself and the jeep down to the bottom of the cliff where Ellie and Muldoon were! Now we'll drive back to the visitors center, but beats me how we get there, seeing as how we are now INSIDE the T-Rex paddock and not on the main road."
Hahahahaha I never thought of this.. cuz the fuckin' T-Rex does break through some huuge tree branch, but the car they were in was outside the fence??

Not to mention how one could hear a T-Rex's stalking footsteps during a rain storm, but not when he's walking through the main lobby of a prehistoric museum.
post #48 of 72
Also, a friend of mine SWEARS the branches in the tree where Sam Neill and the kids sleep move around. There are more when they wake up than when they went to sleep!

And when the helicopter arrives at the island, and Hammond says "There it is" or something, he leans forward looking at the island - but he's facing the WRONG WAY, looking out behind the helicopter!

Stupid movie!
post #49 of 72
The thing that pisses me off the most is the very last shot. The Island is west of Costa Rica, yes? But at the end, they fly off even further WEST into the sunset.

So unless they're going to cross their fingers and hope to make it to Japan, they're going the WRONG FUCKING WAY.

Chaos theory strikes again.
post #50 of 72
Ha ha! Yeah thats right.

I also like the 'Richard Attenbrough is the Flash' effect at the beginning where Hammond manages to race from the helicopter to Alans trailer without anybody seeing him! Its like, the chopper has just landed, Alan rushes up to it, the pilot points to the trailer, and Hammonds in there helping himself to champagne! Man, that old guy can move.
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