The Musical Appreciation Thread

I have much love for Singin' in the Rain, West Side Story, and Chicago.

I have very little love for Moulin Rouge or An American in Paris.

Jesus Christ Superstar was one of the first pieces of music I ever latched onto as a kid. To this day, It stands the test as one of my favorites, despite/because of the goofiest costumes known to man.

Also love for Little Shop Of Horrors and Chicago.

And just to offset the hate, I have much love for Moulin Rouge.

Even if you don't like the rest of the movie, if "Over The Rainbow" from Wizard of Oz doesn't move you, then you need to check for a soul.

I also third the "Singin' In The Rain" love. Donald O'Connor's "Make 'Em Laugh" number is jawdropping.

And even though it's cheesy, long as hell, and historically inaccurate, I hold a special place in my heart for "Newsies." It would have been better as a Broadway show though, but that was the first musical I ever really loved.

Parts of "An American In Paris" I really liked. The last fifteen or twenty minutes, though, are just a filmed ballet. Really cool to watch, but it runs a tad long. And then the movie just...ends with no real resolution other than that the leads get together.

What did I start....

Does the "Buffy" musical episode count? 'Cause that was pretty sweet.

I haven't seen too many musicals but of the ones I've seen I've pretty much liked them all except The Phantom of the Opera (2004). I didn't mind Chicago (didn't deserve Best Picture though) and the South Park movie is pure class.

My favorite musical is Popeye. Great songs, great design. That movie has alot of heart.

I like all the ones mentioned, too, especially West Side Story. I used to hate Oklahoma for some reason (because I was just a dumb kid?) but someone I work with was playing the soundtrack the other day and I thought the songs were pretty entertaining. I'd like to see some of the better Indian musicals but I'm not familiar with that genre at all. Any suggestions?

Oh geeze, how could I forget the Rocky Horror Picture Show? Awsomeness to the max!

My favorite musical remains My Fair Lady. I know a lot of people who think it's a "girly" movie, when really, it's gloriously chauvenistic. It's full of some killer performances, captures the radiant beauty of Audrey Hepburn like few other films ever did, and has the towering performance of Rex Harrison's Henry Higgins. It's such a beautifully photograpphed movie, capturing the beauty of old London, as well as the grime of the streets. Then there's the costumes, which are nothing short of genius (the social satire on display at the race track is totally done through the costumes). The musical score is really moving too, not just in the musical numbers, but in the normal score as well. I'm a sucker for the score towards the end, after the "I've Grown Accustomed to Her Face" song. It's so bittersweet and perfect, before moving onto the finalé, closing out the Hollywood musical era. My Fair Lady was sort of the last of its kind, but it's also one of the best.

In addition to that one, I've always thought Singin in the Rain was one of, if not the, greatest musicals ever put on film. It's a love note to the birth of motion pictures as we know them, as well as a tribute to some classic songs that would've been forgotten had it not been for this movie.

As far as recent musicals go, my favorite is certainly Chicago. Moulin Rouge was pretty much the textbook example of how to self-indulge yourself right into a mediocre product, and the acclaim and love it recieved around its time of release still boggles me. Hedwig and the Angry Inch was released the same year and is a far, far, far better film.

So would faux- rock and roll documentaries or bios like Spinal Tap or Hedwig and the Angry Inch be considered musicals? I like that kind of stuff, too. What about Velvet Goldmine, which had songs not performed by the actors, but had music video-like song interludes?

And here's a silly secret of mine: When I was a kid I watched Xanadu and Grease all the time, because I had a crush on Olivia Newton John, and I prefered Xanadu. I still prefer its soundtrack over Grease's even though it's easily the inferior film. I had both soundtracks, but I wore the E.L.O. side of the Xanadu soundtrack out. And that's how I discovered E.L.O., which was a great band.

Oh yes, Hedwig definitely counts. What a great movie. What great music, too.

One of my very favortie rock-musicals though, is Brian De Palma's Phantom of the Paradise, with music by Paul Williams of The Love Boat theme and The Muppet Movie soundtrack fame, not to mention his acting in all three of the aforementioned as well as other highly-valued bits of 70's absurdity such as Smokey and the Bandit.

But yeah, Phantom of the Paradise is definitely one of De Palma's best movies. Some great split-screen stuff, fun music, and a really ridiculous plot.

That musical episode of Xena was pretty great as well, and I really think it doesn't get the credit it deserves. But credit for what, exactly. Hmmmm....

West Side Story is still the zenith as far as I'm concerned (which is funny, because as a kid I used to tease my mom and sister incessantly for their enjoyment of it). It just gets everything so right, and it avoids the trap that so many musicals (especially Moulin Rouge) seem to fall into -- it actually remembers it's a musical and holds the music close to its core and lets it be a natural part of it. Moulin Rouge seemed to be a glorified music video the way it was edited, with absolutely no flow or sweep despite having some really strong music in it (albeit swiped from modern sources). The Phantom of the Opera committed the same sin, insisting on bland close-ups and static long shots where not much is happening but people singing. The visuals had none of the grandeur that the music has.

I think I would rank Nightmare Before Christmas up there as well. The remarkable animation aside, Elfman knocked this score out of the park, and the baffling treatment of this film as a red-headed step-child by Disney robbed him of at least an Oscar nomination.

And speaking of Disney, let's not overlook their animated musicals. Hunchback of Notre Dame and Little Mermaid had Broadway-worthy scores (although I would kill to see that version of Hunchback with no sidekickc and the book's ending -- "Hellfire" shows they had the chops to pull it off).

I'll also echo the love for Little Shop of Horrors, and add some kudos for On the Town, The Music Man, Oliver, My Fair Lady, and yeah, Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory.

How about "The Umbrellas of Cherbourg"? OK--it's more like an opera than a musical, but it's an amazing movie. Fantastic music by Michel Legrand, a color scheme that in not only stunningly vivid but actually functions like a commentary throughout the film, a story that captures the feel of life in postwar France. Even better, a heartbreaking love story (hey--guys have feelings too), with no easy outs for anyone. And Catherine Deneuve at her most beautiful. You her the word "luminous" thrown around for actresses who don't rate it, but it's hard to imagine that an ordinary human being can look like she does. The film was restored a couple of years ago, and the DVD transfer is great.

I LOVE musicals.

I am much more partial to the golden era MGM stuff than the later stuff from Warner Bros. or even now. FOOTLIGHT PARADE with James Cagney is a classic and one of my favorites. My favorite Fred and Ginger film is THE GAY DIVORCEE even though it's not considered to be one of their best.

Honestly I couldn't give a rat's ass about WEST SIDE STORY, it just never did click with me...neither did MY FAIR LADY. However, I know people love these films and I can understand why I guess.

I thought MOULIN ROUGE was about half of a really good movie. It had so many problem though, like no chemistry whatsoever between the leads. It was alternately touching and really stupid, like it couldn't make its mind up what kind of movie to be. Baz Luhrman didn't really strike that delicate balance in musicals of being light and moving simultaneously. Plus, I found it pretty insulting that he didn't trust the audience enough to embrace some original music. The performance of "Like a Virgin" in that film is some of the worst garbage I've ever seen in the theater.

CHICAGO was better than the stage production, I thought, but I don't care for the story or characters. Same thing with RENT.

And I'm not ashamed at all to say that I LOVE NEWSIES. I love that freakin' movie like it is my job.

Summah stinks and winta's watin'
Welcome to Noo Yawk
Boy ain't nature fascinatin'
When youse gotta wawlk!

Also, the remake of Shaft is that much funnier if you realize Bale's basically aping his Jack Kelly accent from Newsies.

Not really. The celebrated dance sequence at the end just feels very self-indulgent and pointless. There aren't also that many good songs.

I haven't really dived into the scary world of musicals yet, but I have an undying love for: The Rocky Horror Picture Show, Nightmare Before Christmas, Little Shop of Horrors, Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory, that musical episode of Buffy, and a few Disney movies.

I didn't really care for Chicago and I don't ever want to see Moulin Rouge, I figure I'll start my education with the classics and slowly move through history before I actively seek out any more modern stuff.

Say what you will about Moulin Rouge--and I know you will--I appreciate it for attempting to move the art of the film musical forward, which is something that hasn't really been done in ages. Now that musicals are back, sort of, Hollywood seems determined to just literally take Broadway shows and put them up on screen.

I'm cool with The Producers, but --while I admit I haven't seen it--I'm really, really leery about "Rent".

Even on stage, the idea of the musical has been evolving quite a lot in the 20-30 years since they stopped making film musicals. (Anyone ever seen Stephen Sondheim's "Assassins"? There's proof that you can do a stage musical that's relevant and powerful and still be demented and fun.) There's an incredible amount of untapped potential in film musicals, but I doubt mainstream Hollywood is going to tap into it. Hedwig, Moulin, and Buffy are the most experimental film musicals we've seen in recent years, and that's not really saying that much.

Rent's cool when you're sixteen, but I quickly outgrew it, not having lived in New York during the time it represents. It seems to me like it's the "Hair" for the late 90s. I admire Larson for trying to do what few had done up to that point--fully merge the classical Broadway musical with rock and roll.

And yeah, the movie looks okay, but again, it should have been done, say, four or five years ago.

Singin' in the Rain is the best as far as I'm concerned. I'll go against the grain, kind of, and profess love for An American in Paris. In terms of musicals, Sondheim is a synonym for the greatest execution of the best possibilities on stage. The guy's a monster, and EVERYTHING I've seen or heard that he's done is fabulous. Sweeney Todd is great, Sunday in the Park With George is fabulous, West Side Story obviously, and you should catch A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Forum if it ever runs on a stage near you. Passion is one of the most touching things I've ever seen, okay, I'm going to stop now, but just look at the guy's credits and see or hear the stuff in whatever form you can.

Newsies is great, as is Nightmare. But I just can't get into My Fair Lady. I've tried very hard to love that movie, but I can't even bring myself to like it just a little. For me, it commits one of the worst sins of a movie musical in that it becomes boring. Not in an American in Paris ballet kind of way, I found that to be interesting and neat, but in a very, very boring way. I've watched the movie twice, and fallen asleep both times. I really want to see what others see in it, and I love the songs, but I can't get past that racetrack scene without going to bed.

When I saw him speak last year, Sondheim said that he's read John Logan's script for the upcoming Sam Mendes adaptation of Sweeney Todd. He says that it's great--that it's both faithful to the film musical tradition (Sondheim himself is a film nut) and to the play. With the upcoming revival starring Michael Cervasis and Patti LuPone, it should be an interesting couple of years for "Todd."

I think Moulin Rouge has more value as a contemporary entry in the "musical" category than as a film itself. But there were others before it, Everyone Says I Love You and Kenneth Branagh's sad Love's Labor Lost.

It's too bad that Hollywood just hasn't really reconnected with the musical yet. Transferring Broadway to the screen is not the same thing as a true movie musical (although I do realize that some of the great musicals like The Band Wagon started as stage shows)....movie musicals and stage musicals have different conventions, different "rules" if you want to go that far. If Hollywood is truly going to rediscover the genre, it is going to have to relearn these conventions. And the first rule should be to ban Nathan Lane from all movies.

What ever happened to Vin Diesel's remake of Guys and Dolls? I might get a little excited for that.

Down With Love would have been a great musical if a) songs were included and b) Renee "I Thrive on Ruining Otherwise Good Movies" Zellweger had been ejected pre-production.

Oh, and back to my unashamed love of Newsies, I have to say, that movie never looked the same to me after American Psycho. Jack gets a crazy look in his eyes every now and again...he's singing and dancing one minute and the next he looks like he's thinking to himself, "I've got a chainsaw for each and every one of you!!" Blood drips on Newsies Square, indeed!

Oh, and one more question re: Newsies.....

Has anyone read American Psycho? Do Patrick Bateman's sheets *really* come from Santa Fe (as he says in the film) or was that a strange shout-out to Newsie fans? I've never thought of Santa Fe as a mecca of fine linens, but perhaps I'm wrong. Either way, it's a little odd.

If there's a show that has near universal love from theater techs the world over, it's Sweeny Todd. It's the metatextual thing about killing the folks that go on stage, methinks. Plus, most techies have morbid, fucked-up senses of humor.

What? No love for South Park: BL&U?

I would give anything to see Queensryche's brilliant album Operation: Mindcrime brought to the silver screen as a musical in the mold of "Sin City". "Suite Sister Mary" could be fucking huge with the right talent.

It would of course be distilled to a PG-13 for the Mtv crowd, and totally ruined, so such things are best not brought up in the first place.

South Park BL&U is a great modern musical, not just for the humor, but it has some of the best songs written for film in a long time.

Also, Sondheim fans, or really just anybody, should head over to Amazon for a Sondheim DVD Collection ridiculously discounted at $49. I'm pretty sure it's just filmed stage versions of the plays, but that doesn't mean that they're bad at all (luckily, they included a different Sweeney Todd than the version with Angela Lansbury, which outside of Lansbury and George Hearn, had some quite poor singing). Anyway, if you love musicals, this is a set to pick up, and it's 58% off!

That Sondheim box is going to be MINE.

I loved Chicago.. and all that jazz...

Which means the studio boss was a smart man.

How about "Hard Day's Night" and "Help"?
Granted, "Help" is not as good by quite a bit as "Night" but both are fun, the music in both is great, and you see the most influential and culture impacting rock group at the hieght of their popularity.
90% of Elvis' movies are crap, but "Jailhouse Rock" is the exception. You see why Elvis was had such a impact in that film.

Nice thread. I'm making a "must see" movie musical list from these posts...

I saw "The King and I" recently and I've forgotten how amazing Yul Brenner was in that role. No wonder he performed the role for decades and with so many different productions. He was the King.

Loved "Rent". The CDs are still in heavy rotation in my CD player at home. But I'm wary about the movie version. I think if they can pull off the same atmosphere and feeling that "Fame" had which I think had a really cool inner-city, New York, la vie boheme feel to it then it will work.

It starts and stops for me with The Sound of Music. Don't know why but that one just works for me while I find almost everything else in the genre really insufferable. I've seen My Fair Lady at least a hundred times thanks to it being one of the few VHS tapes we owned when I was a kid, and I like it a lot more now than I did then because I get it a lot more, but Sound of Music is still tops.

I forgot to mention "On the Town" as one of the greats. Ann Miller was a goddess.

High Society is one of my favorites. Grace Kelly gives one of her most lively performances and Frank Sinatra and Bing Crosby are great together.

wow, cant believe all the An American in Paris hate, to me its even better than Signin in The Rain, to me its just full on charming Gene Kelly, and Levant is to me is the better actor for him to bounce off then Danny Kaye, although Make Em Laugh is still the best comedic musical number of all time.

I also have to say I love Moulin Rouge but can only watch parts of Chicago, my Zelweger hate may be inplay, but I dont like Kidman either but she works in Rouge and of course Ewan is working across from her.

My rankings
1. An American In Paris
2. The Bandwagon
3. The Sound of Music
4. Singin In The Rain
5. West Side Story
6. Moulin Rouge
7. Wizard of Oz
8. Top Hat
9. Meet Me in St Louis
10. Showboat

I would put Nightmare on there but I would put in the landmark animation category

I'm floored by the lack of discussion for Disney's musicals. Animated or not, I think these are about as close as you get to the power musicals can have. "Beauty and the Beast", "The Lion King", "The Little Mermaid", "Pocahontas", there was a run with Alan menken there that was just amazing. Listen to the lyrics to those songs. There's some really clever stuff in there, especially if we're comparing to live action musicals, and live action can't match animation in terms of the pure spectacle.

I really liked Chicago. The music in it was great, but my favorite is Phantom of the Opera.

Should I be ashamed that the only "musical" I could ever watch more than once is The Blues Brothers, which I'm thinking by its lack of mention might be considered a shit example?
Hated Chicago, Moulin Rouge was good the first time, the second time, just didn't happen. I have tried and failed to sit through some of the others listed here and just flat out not been interested in others. I should note, there are two exceptions here in the form of South Park and the Buffy ep both of which I enjoyed.

Other favorites: Funny Face, Hair, Bells Are Ringing, Kiss Me Kate, Finian's Rainbow, Tommy, The Pajama Game, Gypsy.

First off, very cool thread. Secondly, I'm with you, Stew. We have the soundtrack to "The Lion King" in our CD carousel, and anytime the film version of "Circle of Life" randomly plays, it still gives me goosebumps.

Also, last Christmas, my wife got the "That's Entertainment" DVD box set as a gift from her Mom. Great discs full of old Hollywood, and an excellent way to whet your appetite for musicals. Most of the classics mentioned here are clipped in the collection.

Cool thread.

I know everyone lists SINGIN' IN THE RAIN, but it's such a great movie and so fun that I have to list it here. OLIVER isn't very good, but I do love the music. HEDWIG, yeah. CHICAGO - love it. MOULIN ROUGE - very mixed feelings. Can't wait to see DREAMGIRLS. RENT the film sucks. PHANTOM OF THE OPERA the film sucks. EVITA is an interesting failure, but I do admire what it was trying to do. GREASE - heh. FOOTLIGHT PARADE - whenever Cagney dances and sings you gotta stand up and cheer.

Pocahontas? You mean the musical that gave us the lyric "They're not like you and me, which means they must be eeevil!" from the man that would later foist Wicked upon the world, as if Godspell wasn't enough?

Anyway, I posted this in the Hercules thread, but aside from "Hunchback," Alan Menken's quality of work really declined when Howard Ashman died. His later scores, like "Hercules", are all over the place. The recent docu on the Little Mermaid disc really illustrates how important Ashman was not just to their collaboration, but to the success of the movies themselves as well.

I'll give Menken "Newsies," for its singing and dancing Bill Pullman and "Carryin' The Banner" (featuring Fox News' future motto, "If I hate the headline, I'll make up the headline") and also for sheer nostalgia.

And god help me, I thought there were parts of RENT that really worked--mainly, "Seasons of Love" and the reprise of "I'll Cover You." But I was never a huge fan of the musical to begin with, and I found myself doing the same thing with the movie I do with the CD--skipping ahead to my favorite numbers and discarding the rest.

The DVD's worth a rental for musical theatre noids, though, because there's like an hour and a half documentary about Jonathan Larson and the making of the musical on it. And any fan of the musical form should definitely check out the six-part documentary PBS did a few years back--"Broadway: The American Musical".

Okay...big fan of musicals from way back. I've been fortunate enough to see several of my faves at the Muny Opera in St Louis live....mostly when I was a teen.

Movie musicals are a mixed bag for me. I had "West Side Story" as my fave movie ever for the longest time. It's still in the top three. And I love the MGM musicals. Mostly for the Gene or Fred stuff. Fred is just jaw-droppingly graceful....case in point: Making a coat rack look good as a partner in "Royal Wedding". Gene was just the king of vibrant dance in his movies.

And while "Jailhouse Rock" is grand, I still think "King Creole" gives us the best example of prime Elvis. Plus, you got Walter Matthau out to gun the King down. How can you not love that?

Big props to South Park and Nightmare, too. Great stuff in both flicks.

These are musicals, not Shakespeare. I'd challenge you to find any musical that didn't have a few a few melodramatic groaners. It's the nature of the genre. I liked that "Pocahontas" did a story at least partially rooted in history, and the lyrics for the villain and describing the two groups were, overall, pretty clever.