LOST - Season 3 - Page 9

He and Jin weren't staked out that far from the boat. It's not unreasonable to assume that the Others might scope out the area before revealing themselves. And even going up against a few of the Others should have given him pause.

It was just a convenient, easy way to take the boat out of the equation and keep the staus quo by giving Sayid, Sun and Jin no option but to return to camp.

What's going to be interesting is that they have to walk back to camp through Others land, which is going to be hard now that they've shot (and presumedly killed) one of them.

I agree with all the bad-mouthing of sayhid's plan.

Even if the others didn't know about the boat, they have seen the sneak attack before, and should not have expected them to casually walk up to the signal fire, as Hewlett said.

I think that was pretty bad writing, at least for the character of Sayhid. Even if he's desperate, he's not a dumbass who'd put the lives of sun, jin, and their unborn baby in danger with a half-baked plan. I mean Sayhid knew Michael was lying, and has been witness to their deceptions, etc., so to do that was compeltely out of character, and sloppy stuff from the writers.

Good theory. It also ties in with the strange behaviour of the smoke monster, not attacking people who aren't afraid/violent.

I'm personally leaning towards the idea that the original experiment has been abandoned and the Others, who were the children of the original project, have warped it into some kind of religion, like I say. Of course this begs the question of why they still have contact with the outside world, but again, given the behavioural experimentation we've seen, it could be that Hanso just started treating the island like a gigantic sociological petri dish. I'm definitely betting that the Others are being manipulated by Hanso and the outside world, anyway.

Like I said earlier, I fully expect Buck to go ballistic when he hears Trixie was dropped. After their kiss goodbye, I figured her to be a new regular and was genuinely surprised when Sun dropped her. The question will be, does Buck take it out on Sun, Jin, and Sayid in the jungle, or Kate and Sawyer at the work camp?

What Hewlett said -- it's a bit silly to think the boat wouldn't become an objective once the Others see it (or that the Others would just step onto the open beach). It's too valuable to leave so vulnerable. I appreciate what the writers wanted to accomplish by the end of the episode, but they could have tried a little harder to come up with a GOOD plan for Sayid, and a better one by the Others. Instead a bad plan easily sidestepped.

Anyway, like I said, still loved the ep, just bitching for bitching. It's great how they upended Sun's whole "poor emotionally abused delicate flower perservering" persona we've been fed the past 2 years. Everything said about Jack's and Linus's scene was dead-on. So well done. ("Benry"s a little too cute for me. I'm callin him Linus. Too great a name.)

Now bring on the hatch survivors.

Show me an example of an Iraqi officer who was a GOOD strategist.

I agree, he was the smartest one not buying the Henry Gale bullshit and knowing what was up with Michael, yet now he's a moron?

The whole episode was a little dissapointing in my book.

Sayid, at this point, is more interested in straight payback than forming a strong plan. You could see that in 'Live Togther, Die Alone" when he rushed the huts on the rocks on his own. He knew Sun wasn't buying his plan at the dock, but he went ahead anyways. He just wanted to engage the Others and take some - payback for Shannon, payback for getting fooled by Fenry.

Not sure about Walt, but did they snatch the other kids so they could get them out of there and to safety? (as in OFF the Island)

I mean, they explain to Jack that they have connections to the "outside world". Maybe they SEEMED interested in the kids, but in reality just wanted them so they could send them home, have them be "safe" because they're more interested in the adults.

That would explain why we haven't seen any of them around, right? Or are they all baking cookies in Tim Burton town, center of the island?

And except it didn't suck.

Sorry, I just couldn't resist....

Nice.

So am I the only one who thinks that Sawyer and Trixie have a pre-existing relationship?

Have the show's producers already forgotten about Stan (or was it Steve)?

Yeah, the major characters weren't killed by the Others, but they have been killing people. And they might as well have done AL and Libby themselves.

Not to mention Henry almost choked the life out of Ana Lucia with his own hands--Goodwyn tried to kill her as well. Goodwyn also snapped that dude's neck from the tail section. Or the fact that they've shown little hesitation in shooting people (Sawyer) or hanging them from trees to die (Charlie). If they try and go the "Others aren't so bad!" route I'm gonna be pissed because that means they've been stringing us along for the past two years. This vague "people assume the Others are bad" speak has me worried--we think they're bad because they've been presented as a mysterious and dangerous force that kills at will. Making them good guys would be like making Frank Burns a loveable and decent guy.

True, the "Others are bad" thing definitely has a solid basis, but on the other hand, they've done a pretty good job of turning Sawyer, Jinn, and AL into sympathetic characters after some shaky starts, as well as justifying Michael's Benedict Arnold routine.

The castaways are presented as flawed and wrestling with their demons. Henry had no qualms about trying to kill Ana Lucia. Goodwyn didn't blink when he snapped someone's neck. Ethan strung up Charlie without a second thought. Zeke doesn't seem to be very remorseful that he shot Sawyer. The Others' and some of the castaways are both guilty of murder, but their unwavering resolve and claims that they are "good people" make the Others malovent rather than conflicted. It's not a matter of "shakey starts"--these people have killed and will not hesitate to kill again to achieve their own means, whatever these means may be, and have evident conflicts about this. That's not the kind of setup you use when you're trying to get the audience to sympathize with someone.

Now, that's not to say there's no possability of people within the Others' camp to come across as sympathetic (I think Alex is already there), but I see very little evidence that Zeke, Henry or Raging Bitch Psychic Woman (otherwise known as Ms. Clue) are nice people or sympathetic in any way.

Shit, I completely missed this. Anyone know if it's been posted anywhere online yet (if there's more in the interview that's not on the linked page)?

I love this show like few I ever have, and I know there's always been rampant cross-promotion of network material since the dawn of TV, but I have to wonder if anyone in News departments ever rankle at having to give time to these extended advertisements better suited for ET.

Right off with the hardball brush-back pitch:

JAKE TAPPER: Why do you think "Lost" became such a phenomenon?

...

LISA SIMPSON: Mr. Burns, your campaign seems to have the momentum of a runaway frieght train. Why are you so popular?

Anyway, I sure as hell ain't above reading it. Thanks for the link! Now, to overanalyze over my coffee...

Scott?

uhh...is it just me, or did a good chunk of this thread vanish?

edit: it's just me, sorry...

The new TV spots with Locke picking up the knife. I have mixed feelings about this. While I love that he's getting back to his roots, I have a few red flags waving over my head. I hope the show doesn't turn into Attack of the Clones and starts doing things fans (or even actors) want because they sound cool. They did interesting things with Locke in season 2. I hope they build from there, not start over.

That said, "I miss this...."....yeah, I guess that kinda makes sense after being in the hatch for so long in seson 2. And I miss it too.

Oh, I agree. If they try to reform the Others as a whole, it's going to be a tough sell for me. I was just saying that the writers seem to particularly relish making the audience change their feelings about "bad" characters. I think we'll end up seeing a group of sympathetic Others (with Juliet at the forefront), but if they try to reform Ben or Zeke, it will be a lot harder to swallow.

I saw the Nightline piece last night, after having read the entire transcript yesterday, and for me the transcript was much better. The bits that they aired on tv last night - I wasn't watching closely - seemed to be mostly about relating the plane crash to Sept. 11th, which I found probably the least interesting subject in the transcript.

In summation, just read the transcript, it's better and more complete.

Part of this might be stemming from Terry O'Quinn himself. I believe that he's stated he was displeased with the route his character took last season and wanted to see Locke return to his roots, as it were. Then again, Lost is known for its clever (and misleading) advertisements and previews.

Today's episode is going to be great. I can't wait to see what happened in The Swan bunker. I can't wait to see Locke back in MacGyver mode, which already seems likely with that makeshift flamethrower that he had in the promo at the end of last weeks episode, and seeing Desmond as a regular, and Mr. Eko back.

Last weeks's episode was pretty cool also. Sayid kicked major ass, especially with his capture 2 of them line.

That ad made me laugh. It seemed like such a desperate, pandering attempt to show fans that the Locke of S1 would be back. I'm surprised they didn't have Terry O'Quinn look directly into the camera and wink after that "I missed this" line.

I'm worried that they don't understand why people are still bugging them about the plane in Kate's briefcase. That actually kind of sums up the problems with the show to date. The mysteries of the island are solid, but the character arcs are often based on them acting like drunken teenagers.

Alright... that was a mind trip.

And there's 40 minutes to go.

The polar bear chase was very, very, very The NeverEnding Story. And Hurley's entrance was priceless.

The irony is, I missed that line tonight. Anyone hear it, or was it cut?

So, a few things from tonight's ep:

Desmond has some sort of precognitive ability? Hmmmm...Who were the other precogs, anyone besides Claire’s psychic?

The corpse of the Dharma employee in the cave – the insignia was empty, which I believe is the insignia for the Pearl, so we perhaps know what happened to some of the people involved in that project. Not sure where the bear picked up the toy truck, though.

No wonder the writers have been avoiding the polar bears--there's just not enough of a budget to produce the quality effects needed.

It must have gotten cut. Every time he whipped out the knife and stared longingly at it I kept waiting for the line.

That was actually a pretty good episode. I think the show's been going steadily downhill since early in S2 but this one had a strong S1 vibe. And a bad Locke flashback is way better than anyone else's - good or bad.

Anyone remember Desmond telling Jack "You have to lift it up" when Jack sprained his ankle at the stadium in last year's premiere? There seemed to be something more to that line, and I now wonder if it was Desmond's precognitive ability coming into play. Albeit, what he could be referring to, I don't know.

Is anyone else annoyed that they're bringing in new actors to play substantial roles as survivors who are supposed to have been a part of the group all along?

No, I've assumed all along that that would happen. And now that you're down to, what, 4 regulars on the beach--it's a necessity.

About tonight's episode: I liked the bit about the police doing a psych profile on Locke and seeing him as an easy target. It's a nice piece of information to fill in why Locke freaked out so much at finding out about the experiment.

This is crazy talk, but my first thought after Desmond mentioned Locke's speech was "Um, so he's a Terminator?" He did show up naked out of nowhere...

I think they know that couple from S.O.S. weren't cutting it. Time for some fresh blood.

Of the three episodes shown so far, this has been the best. Locke's flashback was really interesting, and it was cool to see Chris Mulkey. I haven't seen him in anything in long time. Locke's hallucinatory trip with Boone was cool. It was funny seeing Desmond as pilot with stewardess' around him, Hugo as ticket clerk, and Benry as a Baggage checker. This show's hallucinations are starting to rival the one's in The Sopranos.

I loved Hurley's entrance, and Desmond's tye dye "dress." That bit about him already knowing what Locke was going to talk about was strange and interesting. This show just keeps getting better and better.

That annoyed me too. We're just supposed to take it at face value that they have been there the whole time.

"Hey look it's so and so.... don't remember them? Heres a flashback!"

Also the bear looked like PS1 shit.

But overall the episode was very good.

Yeah, it was kind of a ham fisted way to introduce new people. When the shrill Kate clone said "When were you planning on telling us Hurley?!" I half expected him to say "That's cause you weren't here when I left, bitch!"

That's pretty funny because I was thinking the exact same thing.

It might not have bothered me as much if they had been given a more subtle introduction. At least stick them in the background and then gradually give them a few brief lines and some interaction with the other characters. And don't give them stupid lines like "Who took them?". You'd think by now all the survivors would be pretty familiar with the idea that the Others are out there. Who else would she think took them?

Awesome. Anyway, a few notes:

- I love that the eye-opening motif is back.

- Eko's stick falling from the sky (or technically the tree, but you got the idea) was great.

- I'd be easier to explain things to Vincent.

- Locke being mute is a pretty great twist. Unfortunately, the preview spoiled that he doesn't remain that way, but still.

- That would be awesome if Locke actually robbed a bank.

- Locke's vision was one of the best things this show has done. I loved the hell out of it.

- I dig O'Quinn's little enigmatic smiles.

- Alright...polar bear. Or Santa.

- Much better way to do the polar bear than rushed, crappy looking CGI.

- I got a big laugh from the human scream when Locke threw the knife. At first I thought it was Desmond, but Hurley makes it even funnier.

- "They're like the Einsteins of the bear community."

- "You don't tell me what I can't do." Not quite the line but still nice.

- Locke going in for the hunt: showing us yet again why we all love this guy.

- "Bear? Is that you?"

- Man, Locke was in to growin' the wacky tabacky. Cool.

- Oh CGI bear. Why must you seem so non-threatening?

- Holy shit. Desmond is from the future!

- This is what I love about the show: I didn't know until the last second if John would kill Eddie or not.

- I guess we just met Rodrigo Santoro's character.

So that wasn't Mr. Friendly aka Zeke at Locke'a compound. I believe Locke called him Mike. I was convinced it was.

Eh, polar bear problems? I've seen worse. Way worse. I like that they kept it blurry and fast to help mask the quality a bit, and I thought it was scary (at least in the cave).

At first I thought Desmond's "precognition" was a side effect of the hatch implosion, perhap's similar to Locke's vision and Eko's remarks (you will find them -- you are a hunter). But now I'm not so sure...

He did look like he ought to be Gainey's cousin or something, didn't he?

I think Desmond's precognition was brought about by the hatch, and not a pre-existing condition. Other than that, its a big WTF.

The eye-opening motif was actually there in the season premiere.

Since flashbacks related to a specific story element usually occur in chronological order, I guess we're not going to see how Locke met these people. No big deal, I guess. But it was a nice reminder that all these people had long, presumably interesting lives before they wound up on the island. Having the flashbacks for the more important characters introduce more elements and aspects to their previous lives would be a good step to take. In particular, they REALLY need to do a Jack flashback that's not about his marriage falling apart or his fights with his dad. Tell us about the time he took a trip to China or lost all his money in Vegas or something. I don't know.

Desmond looks like Jesus in that shirt.

I don't think that's coincidence.

Waking up naked..."reborn"..visions and all...

Anyone notice that Boone says to Locke "He takes care of himself" about Desmond in the vision?

What's that all about?

The guy who plays Desmond was in the 300 trailer, right? His line was the only one that wasn't bellowed.