Velvet Goldmine

It's funny, I'm always looking for people to engage with over this film. It's easily one of my favorite movies of all time, for all the reasons you mentioned and more. The actors are perfectly cast and hugely impressive in their roles, especially since some of them are not often lauded for their skills (McGregor) and because others are playing against how we commonly see them (Bale). Even though he's just getting started, Brian Slade is a career-defining role for Rhys Meyers.

The music is great, the narrative is heady, and the story is layer-upon-layer of interesting little queries into imagery, art, and identity. Stir into that all the wonderful tributes to Oscar Wilde (some subtle and some I didn't discover until long after) and you've got a gorgeous, literate film.

There's also a suprisingly sweet love story between the three leads, although they all eventually turn bittersweet.

This movie also introduced me to Todd Haynes, and that's been a real trip.

So yeah, in my opinion this film is a forgotten gem. A must-see.

Loved it, also.

Musical arrangement was fabulous, and Toni Collette's Mandy impresses me more and more each time I see it. Placebo's 20th Century Boy cover is one of a my all-time favourite covers, too.

I agree with this, especially regarding the music. The soundtrack was definitely a successful collaboration of talented artists. My opinion of this film is colored, though. You shouldn't watch most films for the first time on acid. With this one, though, I'm glad I did.

EDIT: I didn't see it in the theater.

I couldn't get into this. It felt technically proficient, and as already said, literate, but also emotionally impenetrable. The story kind of gets elliptical and the parallel stories get a bit confused for me, and you never really get inside these characters. But it was cool enough to demand a re-watching I should get to someday. Also, it would be cool to see a sequel.

Maybe you should try the acid. Just kidding. I don't know about a sequel. It was inspired by the early careers of David Bowie and Iggy Popp. I knew a guy who worked with latter-day Iggy. He said he needs coke-bottle glasses. He doesn't wear them on stage, so he can't even see his audience when he performs. Sad.

EDIT: I wasn't kidding.

I absolutely can't fathom a sequel to this movie (although the knowing glances in the bar at the end leave a lot unsaid). I just don't think it would work, even though the weird fascist element of Reynolds' America is worth exploring.

Naturally since a sequel would never work, I want one very, very badly.

Uh oh, I'm agreeing with Fab. Is that a sign of the Apocalypse?

I also just didn't find everyone in the film *except Toni Collette* having sex with each other to be interesting. Not necessarily offputting so much as boring. Although seeing Bale on the roof... that was definitely different.

Too much young Obi Wan's visible junk jiggling around. Thumbs way down.

In the "Batman Continues" thread where we learn that a large portion of the cast of Nolan's Bat-Franchise has engaged in on-screen anal.

Velvet Goldmine starts out of the gate SO strongly that it's a real letdown when it starts to kind of narratively unravel. There's all that great riffing on 70s glam rock, album covers, stage shows, and the Citizen Kane framework just starts eating its own tail.

I'm going to get yelled at, but there's a good deal of queer cinema that falls apart narratively. Hedwig runs out of steam in its last act, all those drag/camp comedies I see on IFC and Sundance (Die Mommie Die, etc.) tend to just peter out. Araki can't carry a plot (til Mysetrious Skin, at any rate). It was a common aflaw that has shaken out in recent years (Far From Heaven is, for me, where Todd Haynes figures out how to script a film).

On screen Anal = Punk band name.

Please explicate, for I find this statement falacious. And I wouldn't say VG runs out of steam either.

I have always loved Goldmine. True story: I was catching a plane from Portland to NY, and Todd Haynes was waiting with me. He was wearing a Janus films shirt, which I complimented right before we boarded. As it turned out, our seats were right next to each other, so I spent much of the flight BSing with him. One of the first things I said was that I was huge a fan of VG, and he said "Oh, you're the one!" and then said that the target audience was teenage girls. As a fan of that era of music, the film's stars, and Haynes's direction, yeah, you could say I'm a fan. It's a film I've made friends watch and fall in love with. Also, amazing soundtrack.

I could definitely echo those sentiments. I find both films immensely enjoyable, and own the soundtracks. As FILMS, I have found them very top heavy (or front-loaded, I guess). It's just always felt to me that the respective energy of both films (Hedwig to a much, much lesser degree) do not sustain their narratives. There is too much vodka to explain properly right now, maybe tomorrow.

That is the coolness. And I'm happy to report to Mr. Haynes that there are many of us who adore this movie.

Teenage girls, he said? Well, I don't know about teenage, but as a girl and someone not ensorcelled by Jessica Alba, the sight of Obi-Wan and Batman doing it on a rooftop was a lovely, LOVELY thing. Not to mention the snog between McGregor and Rhys Meyers.

But really, those are just bonuses to a great film. Has anyone seen Haynes's Safe?

Oh, and anyone have a favorite song on the soundtrack? There's a couple in the film that are not on the soundtrack that I've been trying to track down.

I dunno about anyone else, but that movie is TERRIFYING.

Ha ha ha. I love this movie and, believe it or not, I saw this movie for the first time on acid too in college at a little art house theatre in Pittsburgh. 3 hits of Egyptian Red Eye blotter. I was already a fan of Obi-Wan from Shallow Grave and Trainspotting and I knew Christian Bale would eventually be a big name.

Great, underrated film.

Well, I can't add too much here - love the music, love the story. As far as it "running out of steam" I think that's a natural sort of occurrence - it's somewhat of a mystery, and as things fall apart there's going to be a certain level of narrative torpor. I feel it slows a bit, but it's a natural progression from the subject matter - in rock, artists are young and hungry, and getting big and living the sex, drugs, rocknroll lifestyle is EXCITING. But once you make it big, I am not surprised that to some extent it can become a grind, or like any other job. Especially if you have the appetite for excess many of the characters did.

Like what?

I like Goldmine more than 24 Hour mainly because I find that particular time in music (70s Glam over Manchester Rave) more interesting. Although Goldmine has its faults, it's by no means a perefect. But you got to hand it to them for having Eddie Izzard being the only guy not wearing makeup.

Although I never could figure out the damn facination with Oscar Wilde but people in that scene were obessed about him at the time. But one does wonder what went on in the early 70s between Iggy and Bowie and if such things didn't happen and were imagined, it makes for a damn good story. Great music and Rhys-Ifans looked amazing.

Rhys-Ifans was the goofy roommate from Notting Hill. Jontahn Rhys-Meyers played Bowie-type character. Then he played Elvis. That's cool.

Even though the Brian Slade haircut (the Rhys-Ifans character) fits the definition of a mullet. That would be something I with I could get at some point were not the fact I have wavy hair.

Dyeing it that aqua marine blue on the other hand is a different story altogether.

Rhys-Ifans:



Rhys-Myers:



Rhys-Davies:

The only one I haven't been able to track down is whatever is playing during Bale's first flashback to his school days.

This soundtrack is indeed the shit. Just D/L'd it from I Tunes since I sold it years back. As far as songs in the film that aren't on the soundtrack, try this on for size...

http://www.velvetgoldmine.com.ar/audio.php

Enjoy!!

Rhys-Meyers was phenomenal as Elvis.

Yussssss! That Andy Pratt song was the last one I needed. Thanks for the link. I've actually been to that site a bunch of times but haven't gotten that far. There's actually a pretty devoted little internet following to the movie.

"2HB" is far and away my favorite song on the album, but Jonathan Rhys Meyers version of "Baby's On Fire" is fantastic

Yeah? It's in my Netflix queue but I haven't heard much about it.

Good performance in a mediocre flick. It was a CBS mini series. The first two hours were way better than the last two, but I enjoyed what they did with the very end.

Robert Patrick gets a plus for playing both Elvis' and Johnny Cash's daddies.

Netflix? I didn't know it was on DVD in the states!

It wasn't mediocre so much as it was plotted strangely, moving too quick, glossing over somethings etc.. and is a remake of the John Carpenter mini with Kurt Russell from 78, which is superior in the narrative sense, but the new mini works better in that the music is Elvis's and not some soud-alike as in Carp's version and his relationship with his mother is better explored.

On the plus side, it gets points for shedding light on Col. Tom and showing what a greedy, explotive prick he was. Carpenter's version stayed away from that, for the most part, probably fearing lawsuits since he was still alive when the series aired.

It's also extremely accurate, much more so than "Walk the Line", which is great for an Elvis expert like me. JRM resemblance to Elvis is stunning considering all they really do is give him Presley's hairdo and wardrobe.

Still waiting for a mini chronicling his last years; from Vegas to his death. There's some good drama in there waiting to be mined.

Yeah, it's a nice watch.

I have a very deep appreciation for this film; the era it examines and pays homage to is without a doubt my absolute favorite era in the history of rock.
Part of that appreciation stems from my connection to Bale's Arthur Stuart character in that my introduction to Bowie's Ziggy Stardust period came at an important time when I was trying to define myself as Arthur was and I found comfort in all of the glitz, make-up, and gender-bending. I think any further details of the parallels between myself and Arthur Stuart should be relegated to the appropriate forum, i.e., a therapist's office, so I'll leave it alone, but I will say that I find it quite difficult to watch the scenes of his youth, because they're a direct –and occasionally painful - hit. With that noted, I obviously disagree with VG being an emotionally detached film, because it’s about people finding themselves –or losing themselves - by wearing masks, by assuming roles, adopting myths and so forth. Arthur Stuart is in the same boat as his heroes, just on a smaller scale.

The only "problem" I have with VG actually stems from my being a huge Bowie fan. It's clearly not a biopic, yet it borrows so liberally from that period in his life and career that it seems intent on commenting on him regardless, and frankly, when you look at it from his vantage point, you can easily understand why he'd be as pissed as he was (I mean come on, "Tommy Stone" is a fucking huge slap in the face).
Slade is Bowie all over, right down to the Little Richard infatuation, the quotes “Rock N’ Roll is a prostitute…” and “I want to be a pop idol” (cleverly transferred to Oscar Wilde in VG) even the hokey American wife - although Angela Bowie is viewed quite sympathetically in the person of her tormented analogue, Mandy Slade. Hell, Velvet Goldmine even has a cameo by former Bowie choreographer, mime-coach and purported bedmate, Lindsay Kemp –the “Pantomime Dame” admired by young Brian Slade.

It’s difficult to watch VG having this awareness of Bowie’s life, career, contributions, and controversies and not seeing the potential breakdown of the partition between pure fantasy and character defamation. In fact, the first time I saw VG, I was kind of miffed that they discarded Bowie’s immensely creative period between the years of 1974 & 1980, once again forgetting myself and getting trapped in VG’s pseudo-biopic time-warp.

The aestheticist in me likes Velvet Goldmine for the sounds, the clothes, and the beautiful androgyne men speaking clever and making out with each other, but it manages to dig deeper in that it sort of connects me to all of the kids of that era that found something important and perhaps life-altering in something that out-and-out rejects reality and embraces pure fancifulness and star-gazing.

One last note: Todd Haynes denies it, but I’m pretty confident that glam-rock also-ran, “Jobriath” was an influence on this film. His fans erroneously attempt to build up his honestly lackluster career by proclaiming that because he was absolutely, undeniably queer, he somehow stands above Bowie as a symbol for that period. This is of course, total bullshit; he was gay, but he is to Bowie what the Monkees are to the Beatles, only far less successful. I like his music, but he just wasn’t very talented and whereas Bowie left glam behind to become one of the most lauded musicians/performers in modern history, Jobriath became a cabaret singer and died of AIDS in complete obscurity.

Not pretty, but pretty true.

That Slade becomes Tommy Stone is in some ways analagous to the Bowie of the 80's who was doing duets with Mick Jagger of Dancin' in the Streets, and getting MTV play. Even Bowie himself has admitted that the whole mid-80's period was not who he wanted to be. And I'm sure his homosexual fanbase felt that he had intentionally neutered himself for mainstream success. So if it's hard to watch on those terms, so is the video for Dancin' in the Streets.

I don't disagree, and I'm aware that Bowie has denounced his 80's period as an artistic coma. Yet as something that is ostensibly not a biopic it comes off as a particularly stinging note to leave that character on.

Bowie to this day has to contend with fans of his Ziggy-era being pissed at him for "taking them on a ride" as it were (even though he repeatedly said during that period that he was playing a character and that "nothing I say can be trusted"), that's why I brought up Jobriath - I suppose I should have specified Jobriath's gay fans versus just fans. However I will say that I'm far from convinced that Bowie never engaged in a gay relationship of some kind (see his VH1 Legends episode for a very suggestive comment on his formal years).

And yes, "Dancing in the Streets" is fucking horrible.

But to me, the thing is it's not just about Bowie, it's about dealing with AIDS, and refusing to deal with who you are, and how the 80's - through Thatcher and Reagan - created this faux atomsphere of the 50's in retaliation to the purported decadence of the 60's and 70's. So it's not just Tommy Stone qua David Bowie denying who he is, but a culture being shoved back in the closet. Arguably, in terms of the history of homosexuality in America, that feels right.

Wow.

Well played and perfectly so, you really put that into perspective for me, thank you.

I've always assumed that Slade's first manager is dying of AIDS, on top of the whole parallel to Joseph Cotten's character in Kane, though I'm not sure if that's explicit or not.

That's a great take on it. I like how the film uses the templates of Bowie, Iggy, etc., but confounds any efforts to interpret it as a straight-up biopic. For instance, I remember McGregor claiming that he actually took more from Robbie Robertson and Kurt Cobain than Pop in developing his character's offstage persona. The character's further tweaked in that (at least as far as I know) Iggy was about as hetero as you get - it's pretty doubtful he would have slept with Bowie in real life. Also, in some small ways, his character is sort of filling the vacancy left in the absence of a fictionalized Lou Reed.

This slight distancing is a pretty brilliant move, since the characters carry some of the iconic weight of their real-life counterparts, but Haynes is free to use that weight as the plot requires.

You know, I thought the same thing really.

I enjoyed VG the first time I watched it and after reading this thread I really want to watch it again. Thanks to Dre in particular for the great analysis.

A question.

When Bale's character is being picked by his editor to do the story on Slade, he says:

I always felt "brit" was a placeholder for "fag". There's no real reason why Bale's character would say that sentence with such vitriol, and it makes a lot more sense if you replace the word.



Let me beat the dead horse: sweet insight, man, thanks.

That's another good insight into the set up. I mean I guess you could argue he says "Brit" like that because somehow he was british and grew up around that time, he would know who Slade was better than anyone on staff. But really if that was in fact the case, why would you answer the question like that?

Therefore, what you're saying does make some very good sense.

It's obvious that Bale has spent much of his life denying that past and being in the closet. A phase, that likely went away after having sex with Curt. At that point in the movie, I don't think he's out in any way shape or form, though people may have their suspicions. That reading makes more sense on a second viewing. To me, the point of that exchange is the editor saying "It's because you remember." Something he's been denying himself for years.

That was a great piece (along with great screen cap).

Brilliant text.



Edit - haha, the last three people to post in this thread before it got bumped are doing it again now.

I'm surprised nobody's mentioned the strength of the music in VG. Most "rock" movies fail because nobody making them understands what rock music is. As much as I like Phantom of the Paradise, Rocky Horror, etc., the music all sounds like it was performed by soulless sessions players with no real style of their own. And those are the good examples.

Velvet Goldmine brought in some heavy hitters to write and perform the music: Thom Yorke and Jonny Greenwood of Radiohead, Ron Asheton of The Stooges, Mike Watt of The Minutemen/Firehose, Thurston Moore and Steve Shelley of Sonic Youth, etc. It's a terrific soundtrack and reminds me of what a glam rock album might sound like if produced by Alan Moore.


That being said, my favorite part of the film is it's sense of speculative fiction, as read from the future. It presents an alternative history that, even without the space ship at the beginning, borders on science fantasy.

You know what, I've never seen Velvet Goldmine. I have to rectify. I heard the movie and music is as good as Hedwig.

You're right even though I don't like Hedwig. The music is great in Goldmine. Perhaps it's that mindset, perhaps it's because Rhys-Meyers is such fucking eye-candy in that movie.

The music in both are great, but Hedwig is more in the spirit of glam, rather than a replication of it. The songs in Velvet Goldmine that aren't from the era or covers of songs from the era were designed to sound like they could have been (esp. in the case of Shudder to Think and Grant Lee Buffalo - the Pulp song slightly less so).