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The Miseducation of Patrick Ripoll: King of New York

post #1 of 47
4/5/07 at 12:53pm
Thread Starter 
This film was not on the 50 CHUD Essentials list, but it was on "100 movies that need more love" and Premier's "Top 15 Best Run-DMC Inspired Costume Choices"

I'm showing my age here, but as someone who knows Laurence Fishburne primarily as Morpheus, this movie was a bit of a revelation to me. He plays exactly the kind of character I wouldn't normally associate with LArry Fishburne and he plays him GREAT. It's a rare kind of gangsta character that's loud, violent, impulsive but at the same time there's a certain charm and sweetness to him (he gave those kids quarters to play the arcade machines!).

Same goes for Christopher Walken. I'm begininng to see why his descent into easy paychecks from shitty movies is so tragic. He was really good in this and, just like Fishburne's character, had a great comination of violent and charming. I'm no Walken expert (haven't even seen The Deer Hunter fer chrissakes!) so it was interesting to see him play the lead in a movie not directed by Cronenberg (Dead Zone is another movie I feel doesn't get the love it's deserved, at least by the mainstream).

Walken's character wasn't given the fully satisfying arc I was kind of hoping for, and the juxtapostion of his charity vs. his contribution to gang violence and drug addiction is something I wish we saw more of, but all in all it's a pretty good movie with some pretty great performances.

And that fire hydrant death is spectacular.
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post #2 of 47
4/5/07 at 1:05pm
Easily my favorite lead performance from Walken. The way he takes care of David Caruso is so chilling.

Fishburne is a blast here. I love when he blows away the drug dealer who opens the case full of tampons. If you want more great pre-MATRIX Fishburne check out DEEP COVER immediately.
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post #3 of 47
4/5/07 at 1:06pm
Thread Starter 
Yeah, since that has both Fishburne AND Goldblum, it's already high on my must-see list.
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post #4 of 47
4/5/07 at 1:12pm
If you like Fishbourne, you need to pretty seek out everything pre-Matrix, because post hasn't been that good. He played a great Othello, 'Searching for Bobby Fischer", and of course, weirder stuff like this.

I liked "King of New York"< but it was a while ago, and it didn't make a big enough impression on me outside of weirdness to check it out again. Ferrara's one weird dude, and I actually liked "The Funeral" quite a bit.
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post #5 of 47
4/5/07 at 1:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moltisanti
If you want more great pre-MATRIX Fishburne check out DEEP COVER immediately.
Seconded. The best Fishburne performance ever, and a pretty entertaining flick to boot.

See this on a double bill with "Mr. Frost" to cover some little seen, but essential Goldblum, Patrick.
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post #6 of 47
4/5/07 at 1:18pm
You'll love it. Even though I'm not as big on NEW JACK CITY as many others you could have a hell of a early 90's drug dealer triple bill with KING OF NEW YORK, NEW JACK, and DEEP COVER.

I don't know what happened to Abel Ferrara, It seemed like he was right on the verge of being a director who knew how to get people talking about his films. I know he still makes movies but damned if I've seen or even heard about anything he's done in the last decade.
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post #7 of 47
4/5/07 at 1:54pm
Good movie. One of my favorite parts is the car chase on the bridge with Fishburne blasting away at the cops.
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post #8 of 47
4/5/07 at 1:59pm
You know, I used to love the shit out of New Jack City as a kid.

I caught it on HBO the other day only to realize it's fucking terrible. Ice T is, was and always will be an awful actor. To think I used to love him. I'm not even going to try and watch Trespass again after all of these years.

Fishburne's a fine actor, even in his smaller roles re: Boyz 'n the Hood and Higher Learning.
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post #9 of 47
4/5/07 at 2:07pm
Friend of mine rented Cinderella or some other Disney flick from Blockbuster as a child. He brought it home to watch it and realized they had actually given him New Jack City. Scarred him for life.

Ripoll, make the next movie you see The Deer Hunter. Possibly Walken's best. You're right about The Dead Zone, also... it is way underappreciated.
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post #10 of 47
4/5/07 at 2:17pm

spoilers, ahoy!

Also, this film gets props for White's 2 female bodyguards/fuckbuddies, even though they get greased fairly quickly.
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post #11 of 47
4/5/07 at 2:29pm
Fishburne's best performance, for me, has to be Searching for Bobby Fisher. It's so great.
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post #12 of 47
4/5/07 at 2:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Riviello
Friend of mine rented Cinderella or some other Disney flick from Blockbuster as a child. He brought it home to watch it and realized they had actually given him New Jack City. Scarred him for life.

Ripoll, make the next movie you see The Deer Hunter. Possibly Walken's best. You're right about The Dead Zone, also... it is way underappreciated.
The same thing happened to me. Except it was The Rocky Horror Picture Show and I rented it on purpose. I was 12. I took the "Horror" part literally. Seeing Tim Burton sing, in drag, was rather disturbing.
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post #13 of 47
4/5/07 at 2:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by whiskaz
You know, I used to love the shit out of New Jack City as a kid.

I caught it on HBO the other day only to realize it's fucking terrible. Ice T is, was and always will be an awful actor. To think I used to love him. I'm not even going to try and watch Trespass again after all of these years.

Fishburne's a fine actor, even in his smaller roles re: Boyz 'n the Hood and Higher Learning.
Overall I have liked Ice-T in a few flicks, but I agree he's pretty bad in NEW JACK. If it wasn't his first movie it had to be one of his earliest. He's the second lead in NEW JACK and he just couldn't hang with Snipes back then.

You can't go wrong with Walken in THE DEER HUNTER. Another good turn from him back in the day that gets overlooked is in DOGS OF WAR.
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post #14 of 47
4/5/07 at 3:30pm
The Deer Hunter is the only movie that ever gave me nightmares. And I was in my 20s when I saw it. Walken's performance in that is powerful.

Not that it's a horror movie, mind you. But it's fantastic, powerful, and for some reason gave me dreams of having to kill Walken.
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post #15 of 47
4/5/07 at 3:44pm
King of New York: Watch Walken piss on cue. Now that's getting into character!
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post #16 of 47
4/5/07 at 3:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by whiskaz
Seeing Tim Burton sing, in drag, was rather disturbing.
Ya mean Tim Curry?
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post #17 of 47
4/5/07 at 3:55pm
I remember seeing King Of New York on tape back in 2004, shortly before the special edition was released, and loving every minute of it. I ended up buying the S.E., not long after seeing the tape. There are tons of great lines, "Room service muthafuckas!" is something I still say to this day, and Walken's dispatching of Caruso is indeed disturbing. A simple "Hey. You!" and then he's gone. Every action setpiece was spectacular. The Chinatown shootout, the opening drug deal, the doublecross towards the end. Just great.

I was actually thinking about the movie yesterday afternoon when I was getting home from school, and the scene where Roger Guenevuer Smith and Laurence Fishburne pull up in the Thunderbird to the chicken place. Just a random movie moment that popped in my head. This movie also introduced me to the only rap that I actually like, Schooly D. Saturday Night is a damn certified classic. Gotta love Walken's dance in that scene.

Theresa Randle also never looked finer, as did the lovely Ariane of Year Of The Dragon fame.
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post #18 of 47
4/5/07 at 4:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DARKMITE8
Ya mean Tim Curry?
Damned if it's not too late to go back and edit that. Completely Freudian. Long, boring day at work, too.
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post #19 of 47
4/5/07 at 4:15pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Eko
This movie also introduced me to the only rap that I actually like, Schooly D.
That's the only rap you like? At all? Have you heard any other old school rap? Ultramagnetic MC's, perhaps?
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post #20 of 47
4/5/07 at 4:19pm
Arianne was almost luminous during the party scene. Yeah, a lot better than in YOTD. I also liked seeing Sari Chang (star of Ferrara's underrated CHINA GIRL) pop up in something other than a Fantastic Sam's commercial.

Chris, the guy that peed on cue was Artie. Paul Calderon's reaction in that scene was priceless.
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post #21 of 47
4/5/07 at 4:33pm
I'll jump on the bandwagon to say that I think that it's a great movie too. And a good reason to plan your own Abel Ferrara marathon. With all the buzz about Grindhouse, people should be checking out his old stuff like Ms. 45 and The Driller Killer. He really hit his stride with King of New York and The Bad Lieutenant--even Keitel must have been creeped out making that one. His later films haven't brought him much love, but I think that they've stayed true to his brutal and off-kilter vision. I liked The Addiction, and I think that New Rose Hotel just missed being a masterpiece. As much as I yearn for somebody like John Carpenter to get back on track, I'd like to see a studio give Ferrara the money to make a good movie. I bet he could come up with something that is both extremely disturbing and compelling.
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post #22 of 47
4/5/07 at 8:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Ripoll
That's the only rap you like? At all? Have you heard any other old school rap? Ultramagnetic MC's, perhaps?

I haven't really heard any other old school rap, but I guess I should rephrase my statement, as the only rap I like is anything pre-1997. Mostly late 80's early 90's stuff that I've heard in movies, but I never found out who sung them.
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post #23 of 47
4/5/07 at 8:46pm
There's been plenty of good rap since 1997. It's like anything else, if you truly appreciate the genre, you can find good stuff.
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post #24 of 47
4/5/07 at 9:52pm
I guess I just prefer the old school rap. I just can't get into the newer rap. It doesn't have the same sound that all the older stuff has, and that's what I like best about it. I just hear this new stuff, and I don't like it, but I hear the older stuff, the stuff that I heard in movies, and on the radio when I was kid, and it just clicks with me. That's just how I am with rap music.
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post #25 of 47
4/5/07 at 10:49pm
"I'm black!"

This movie is indeed awesome. I love showing it to people who've never seen it before, too. For the first few minutes I can practically hear them rolling their eyes, but damn if they aren't fucking glued to the screen soon after. Followed by lots of screams of "Holy shit!", especially the Caruso death. White's got balls of steel, I'll tell you that. I love his "I heard that!" line, so fucking funny, and of course Walken shoehorned some dancing into the same scene. Walken goes from likable to downright terrifying in the blink of an eye in this.
I'm kind of sad Buscemi just disappears early on, but then again he was pretty much a nobody then, and it's not like he had a very memorable part.
This movie is what New Jack City wishes it was. All New Jack City has going for it is Snipes nowadays.
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post #26 of 47
4/5/07 at 11:30pm
I would throw in Bad Company as well for Fishburne pre-Matrix. Not as good as Deep Cover or King Of New York, but still a good performance.

I really need to pick up the SE of this movie. Been years since I sat down and watched it all the way through.
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post #27 of 47
4/6/07 at 2:13am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Eko
I guess I just prefer the old school rap. I just can't get into the newer rap. It doesn't have the same sound that all the older stuff has, and that's what I like best about it. I just hear this new stuff, and I don't like it, but I hear the older stuff, the stuff that I heard in movies, and on the radio when I was kid, and it just clicks with me. That's just how I am with rap music.
There's nothing wrong with that, but Schooly D is not the only old-school rapper ever. That's why I suggested Ultramagnetic MC's, another group from the 80's.
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post #28 of 47
4/6/07 at 2:16am
Love this movie but boy does it make me feel yucky.
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post #29 of 47
4/6/07 at 2:54am
Honestly I prefer The Funeral over this by far, I just never understood the love it gets. It has lots of interesting little characters and moments, but it never seems to add up to anything. I remember reading a CHUD DVD review of the movie where the reviewer noted that with his first viewing the movie left him cold, but after subsequent viewings it did a lot more for him, maybe I should try the same.

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post #30 of 47
4/6/07 at 3:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Ripoll
There's nothing wrong with that, but Schooly D is not the only old-school rapper ever. That's why I suggested Ultramagnetic MC's, another group from the 80's.

I'll have to give them a listen to then, thanks for the suggestion Patrick.
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post #31 of 47
4/6/07 at 3:22am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormin
Who the hell came up with this?
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post #32 of 47
4/6/07 at 3:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moltisanti
Who the hell came up with this?
I don't know, but I've seen it before, and it's great.
It should be followed by a shot of hundreds of Mcnuggets, the Hamburgler, Grimace and the rest of the crew running down the cemetery hill in shock as the limo speeds off.
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post #33 of 47
4/6/07 at 4:14am
Ending with a final standoff between the Burger King and Jack in the Box on the subway.
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post #34 of 47
4/6/07 at 4:28am
I think there would be more of an emotional impact if Grimace had the subway stand-off. Jack in the Box can be the hostage, or maybe the wussy cab driver.

I just now realized that the Burger King, is playing the king, the king of New York, that is. Semi-clever, or totally unintentional? You be the judge.
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post #35 of 47
4/6/07 at 6:59am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Ripoll
He plays exactly the kind of character I wouldn't normally associate with LArry Fishburne and he plays him GREAT.
actually, this was where Fishburne perfected the swaggering street hood character he had been adding to and fine-tuning ever since Death Wish 2. a real gold toothed badass who'll hide behind a boom box so that Charles Bronson can't find him, then casually eat some chicken. the chicken-eating motherfucker.
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post #36 of 47
4/6/07 at 7:46am
Just caught this tonight. I really liked the overall tone; Walken and Fish were great. And it gets an A+ in the attractive females department.

But it's just a bit too uneven. It feels like it's trying to have it's cake and eat it, too by attempting to be both a character study AND a broader crime drama. Balancing White's story with the cops stories wasn't quite the right mix, either. More of the cops might've been a nice parallel. Conversely, less of the cops would've been more time for Walken to flesh out White.

Entertaining but not great.
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post #37 of 47
4/6/07 at 12:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Disciple_72
actually, this was where Fishburne perfected the swaggering street hood character he had been adding to and fine-tuning ever since Death Wish 2. a real gold toothed badass who'll hide behind a boom box so that Charles Bronson can't find him, then casually eat some chicken. the chicken-eating motherfucker.
"SUPAH~ FINE."
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post #38 of 47
5/4/07 at 12:41am
Anyone else find the casting of the actress who played Wesley's wife a little odd? They were really going that extra mile to show Wesley as the black cop with the white wife. I mean, maybe it was just me, but it looked like such an odd couple. It was young Wesley Snipes and his school teacher wife.
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post #39 of 47
5/4/07 at 1:13am
Thread Starter 
Wesley Snipes is so black that ANYONE who isn't the complexion of a collapsed star looks strange next to him.
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post #40 of 47
5/4/07 at 4:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Ripoll
Wesley Snipes is so black that ANYONE who isn't the complexion of a collapsed star looks strange next to him.
I don't know. Him and Woody had fairly good chemistry in some fairly bad movies. The problem with his wife in "King Of New York" isn't a skin complextion issue. It's not so much that she's white as that she looks very out of place as a young cop's wife. Like I said, maybe it's me.
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post #41 of 47
5/11/07 at 8:02am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moltisanti
Another good turn from him back in the day that gets overlooked is in DOGS OF WAR.
I rented Dogs of War because of the cover (Walken holding a giant grenade launcher) and let's just say I wasn't disappointed.

It also has a nifty torture scene in it that I've never seen duplicated, where Walken puts broken glass in a guy's mouth and starts slapping his face.
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post #42 of 47
5/15/07 at 8:29am
Any time someone gives me shit for my David Caruso love, I show them this one.

Standouts are his moving final scene with Snipes or his insults to Walken, either "I heard you got AIDS from gettin' dicked up the ass so much in the joint...that's what I heard" or the simple, effective and heartfelt "Welcome home, fuckface".

Thing is, this movie's chock full of ace trash talk. I love it when Fishburne's Jimmy Jump calls the cops "Captain Crunch and the Donut Crew", adding a special shout-out to Caruso and Snipes as "Howdy Doody and the Chocolate Wonder". (Response: Caruso spits in Fishburne's face.)

Then there's Fishburne giving serious attitude in the fried chicken shop: "You got any Birch Beer? You don't even know what that shit is."

I heart this movie.
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post #43 of 47
5/16/07 at 1:44am
I remember watching this movie on tv, knowing very little about it and thoroughly enjoying it(I loved it so much I even bought the SE dvd). My favorite part in the whole movie is when Walken whips out that shotgun and just blows Caruso's ass away.
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post #44 of 47
5/16/07 at 1:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Madman Mundt
I rented Dogs of War because of the cover (Walken holding a giant grenade launcher) and let's just say I wasn't disappointed.

It also has a nifty torture scene in it that I've never seen duplicated, where Walken puts broken glass in a guy's mouth and starts slapping his face.
Yeah, that scene is harsh.

I remember the first time I saw DOGS OF WAR, way over 10 years ago, I was a bit letdown. I was probably hoping for more fireworks. But about a year ago it aired on TCM and it worked much better for me as a character-driven mercenary flick.
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post #45 of 47
6/5/07 at 12:48am
Just finished this. Between this and my viewing of DEEP COVER two weeks ago, I'm getting a great Fishburne experience.

I agree that some of it was uneven, especially the scene right after we are introduced to the cops, which ends up being a giant cop wedding. I think if they introduced the oinks earlier it would have been a better transition. To me it was like they were trying to shoehorn in a comraderie aspect that just didn't feel natural.

That fire hydrant death was unbelievable. Same with Caruso's dispatch. Definitely two 'oh shit' moments for me.

And Theresa Randle was smokin'.
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post #46 of 47
3/20/10 at 8:12am
Entertaining as fuck.

Walken gives such a steely performance, his face is like a Rorschach test for the viewer at times, but it totally works for the movie- to sell this role Walken does a hell of a job. It's got a manic charm that contrasts with the high society scenes, and some great dialogue. It's vicious, it's dirty, it's angry, and it's got Walken dancing, and everyone should see it.
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post #47 of 47
3/23/10 at 3:21am
Solid reccomendation, folks. Thoroughly entertaining and quotable.

I can't say it really amounted to much, and it felt like it rapidly dwindled after the cop assault, but it isn't the kind of movie that needs to amount to anything. It's still a late 80s/early 90s B movie gem, and fizzling 3rd acts are par for the course.

I like how the first half of the movie made you feel like you were looking in to a larger, more intricate, historied crime world...but then you ended up not learning much of anything more about anybody, and then there were a few chase scenes, some cool shoot outs, Christopher Walken gets into a cab, the end. I can't quite tell if it was overedited, or underwritten, or the actors and crew did too good of a job in making it appear deeper than it actually was. Oh well, still a damn fine movie.
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