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CHUD NUMBERS: Box Office Discussion Thread - Page 616

post #30751 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bradito View Post

I'm surprised that "Apocalypse" didn't do so hot. The Quicksilver rescue scene was the goods.

i guess sweet dreams weren't made of these

post #30752 of 35236
Who am I to disagree?
post #30753 of 35236

everybody's lookin' for something...

post #30754 of 35236

I think a hit is something you don't need to discuss. DEADPOOL is a hit, whether we're talking about domestic or WW or its take in relation to budget. And we haven't had a lot of those this summer.

post #30755 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSaxon View Post
 

 

Why not count WW, though? Money is money. It's made $433M on a budget of $160M so, technically, Warcraft's not a flop.

 

Depends. A lower, to much lower amount of the international gross (depending on the country) returns to the studio versus domestic (US + Canada), so Warcraft is a bit touch and go, especially since China can get a much bigger share of the gross than a lot of other countries.

 

I read an article which said it might be looking at a $10-$15 million loss as one possible outcome but with home video, uncounted boosts to things related to the game, VOD/hard copy versions, tax write-offs, TV rights etc etc (and I think it will really break at least even from cinema revenue, it'll at least not lose money, I think).

post #30756 of 35236

Worst case scenario, Suicide Squad is a repeat of Man of Steel. Killer opening, mixed reaction, shit legs. 

post #30757 of 35236
X-Men wasn't a FLOP...but the fact that it did less than Deadpool (it did right?) is what is embarrassing about it. Besides it being Singer's weakest X-Men movie, that is..
post #30758 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bradito View Post

I'm surprised that "Apocalypse" didn't do so hot. The Quicksilver rescue scene was the goods.
I Guess BECAUSE that's one scene in a whole movie.

Yeah, I find myself going to the movies less and less. For a variety of options it's too expensive. Now, with deluxe seating and all that, it's nearly 15 damn dollars a ticket. I really need to want to see a movie of I'm going to pay that much. There are so many things to watch at home. I'm more busy than ever at work so going out in general isn't high on the priority list. This summer, in theaters, I saw civil war and turtles 2. I has a 10 dollar gift card for my theater though. That's it and I'm good with that.
Edited by Racj82 - 7/30/16 at 2:05pm
post #30759 of 35236
It's a good scene.
post #30760 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fraid uh noman View Post

X-Men wasn't a FLOP...but the fact that it did less than Deadpool (it did right?) is what is embarrassing about it. Besides it being Singer's weakest X-Men movie, that is..

The real embarrassment is the fact that, domestically at least, Apocalypse made less than the first X-Men movie did 16 years ago.
post #30761 of 35236
Even I'm embarrassed!
post #30762 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fraid uh noman View Post

X-Men wasn't a FLOP...but the fact that it did less than Deadpool (it did right?) is what is embarrassing about it. Besides it being Singer's weakest X-Men movie, that is..

 

All X-Men film did less than Deadpool. Which I guess technically is also at least somewhat of an X-Men film since it has X-Men in it.

post #30763 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by COULD432 View Post


The real embarrassment is the fact that, domestically at least, Apocalypse made less than the first X-Men movie did 16 years ago.

 

So did First Class. This new X-Men cast isn't drawing in what the old cast did as evidenced by the box office jump of Days of Future Past.

post #30764 of 35236
What a lumpy franchise. Peaks and valleys..
post #30765 of 35236

I think Warcraft is definitely a flop. The vast majority of its earnings came from China. And even that took a huge drop in its 2nd week.

post #30766 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by felix View Post
 

I think Warcraft is definitely a flop. The vast majority of its earnings came from China. And even that took a huge drop in its 2nd week.

 

So if a movie not making a profit isn't your definition of a flop (because Warcraft made its budget back), what is? That not enough Americans watched it? 

post #30767 of 35236
Making it's budget back is about half of what they spend on movies like this. Minus theater commission, back end deals, etc. With something that's supposed to be franchise extension, Warcraft definitely didn't achieve its goals. It didn't get anyone excited about anything, it disappeared from the public consciousness instantly, it made any future Blizzard films untenable (even with China), and I'm not sold on it getting out of the red. By what metric is it not a flop?
post #30768 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSaxon View Post
 

 

So if a movie not making a profit isn't your definition of a flop (because Warcraft made its budget back), what is? That not enough Americans watched it? 

 

Well, it's just China takes a much larger amount of the gross than other countries because they can. Up to 75% or even more. Warcraft may well be less than that because of partnerships with Chinese companies and by extension the government. Also, I think it was Legendary that made it, right? I think that's part Chinese owned or related.

 

 

"Box-Office Analysis: 'Warcraft' Avoids "Utter Failure" But Will Still Lose Money"

 

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/box-office-analysis-warcraft-avoids-910268

 

It should still make money when all the revenue streams are factored in, though.

 

Also, there are intangibles like how much of a boost in revenue in might make for the game. It's also like an advertisement for the game and its merchandise on top of everything else. There's talk that they might make a sequel squarely aimed at the Chinese market next.

 

For example, it doesn't really matter how well Cars movies do for Pixar, at last count, they've sold more than $10 billion in merchandise.

post #30769 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arjen Rudd View Post

Making it's budget back is about half of what they spend on movies like this. Minus theater commission, back end deals, etc. With something that's supposed to be franchise extension, Warcraft definitely didn't achieve its goals. It didn't get anyone excited about anything, it disappeared from the public consciousness instantly, it made any future Blizzard films untenable (even with China), and I'm not sold on it getting out of the red. By what metric is it not a flop?

 

Because if someone if I gave someone $160M and they gave me back $433M, that's still $273M more than I had before. Sure, some of that money went on other things but I'm not convinced it still didn't make its money back. Pacific Rim made less on a higher budget and is still getting a sequel, so I don't think that possibility is "untenable". 

 

If we're going to judge all movies on public consciousness, most movies would be flops because we live in a culture where things are quickly discarded so that we can move onto whatever is next. The average cinema-goer probably doesn't even remember what they saw a few weeks ago.

 

I'm really not convinced it can be dismissed as a "flop". 

post #30770 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shan View Post
 

Also, there are intangibles like how much of a boost in revenue in might make for the game. 

 

I'd actually love to know the data on this, although Blizzard will probably never release it (assuming they're able to gather it in the first place).

post #30771 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSaxon View Post

Because if someone if I gave someone $160M and they gave me back $433M, that's still $273M more than I had before. Sure, some of that money went on other things but I'm not convinced it still didn't make its money back. Pacific Rim made less on a higher budget and is still getting a sequel, so I don't think that possibility is "untenable". 

If we're going to judge all movies on public consciousness, most movies would be flops because we live in a culture where things are quickly discarded so that we can move onto whatever is next. The average cinema-goer probably doesn't even remember what they saw a few weeks ago.

I'm not convinced it can be dismissed as a "flop". 

The budget number doesn't include marketing costs, though, and the gross number doesn't account for the money that the theaters keep, which in foreign countries (especially China, where Warcraft made half its money) can be quite high. The general rule of thumb is that a movie needs to triple its reported budget to break even. By that metric, Warcraft probably broke even, but it didn't make anybody any money and its terrible legs everywhere signal there is probably little interest in a sequel.
post #30772 of 35236
Aren't all movies flops because of creative accounting? Some just flop harder than others.
post #30773 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by COULD432 View Post


The budget number doesn't include marketing costs, though, and the gross number doesn't account for the money that the theaters keep, which in foreign countries (especially China, where Warcraft made half its money) can be quite high. The general rule of thumb is that a movie needs to triple its reported budget to break even. By that metric, Warcraft probably broke even, but it didn't make anybody any money and its terrible legs everywhere signal there is probably little interest in a sequel.

 

I guess we're just going to have to wait until the dust clears on the merchandising, home video sales, and streaming rights, to see where this one lands. 

post #30774 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by User_32 View Post

So did First Class. This new X-Men cast isn't drawing in what the old cast did as evidenced by the box office jump of Days of Future Past.

And I suppose DOFP drawing more audiences didn't necessarily make anyone more enamored with the new cast. I guess if they tried doing the second film without the old cast, there never would have been a third film.
post #30775 of 35236
DOFP also had Wolverine, which might be significant.

Also, WRT Warcraft, unless there's some precise description of what a flop is that I'm unaware of, I feel more than confident calling it a flop. I'm just looking at the way it was a moderate to large disappointment in just about every aspect of its performance. For an IP used to enormous success, they appear to have overshot their mass appeal and cultural saturation point. Pokemon might be a wildly profitable game franchise, but the movies have a low ceiling, and it seems true for Azeroth as well. At least as they presented it here, and they really shot their wad on this one.
post #30776 of 35236

Flop is very much dependent on relativity (budget) and perception (expectations).  In discussions of such things, it's really not an exact science since there are so many variables.  I'd say Warcraft is definitely a domestic flop that was largely seen as being 'kiiiiinda saved' by China.  But as mentioned, it's really hard to tell where that IP goes from here.  It COULD happen.  It might not.  If it does happen, those involved need to go back and retool how they approach such a thing.

post #30777 of 35236

Has any video game property succeeded as a film franchise? 

 

The Transformers films were based on toys, so there's a parallel with video games in that it's a "build your own world" thing, yet those films have made bank. 

 

I guess Mortal Kombat did well enough to warrant a sequel, but it didn't exactly set the world on fire....

post #30778 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cylon Baby View Post
 

Has any video game property succeeded as a film franchise? 

 

Resident Evil.

post #30779 of 35236

Only because they can churn those out for 25 cents a pop. 

post #30780 of 35236
But with marketing, that's at least $0.50
post #30781 of 35236

LIIIIIIIIEEEESSSSS!

post #30782 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by felix View Post
 

 

Resident Evil.

 

I bought a ticket to see each of the first four at the cinema. I paid to see the first one at the cinema twice.

 

Resident Evil 5: Retribution was the first ever film I paid to watch through a legitimate distributor on Youtube (the other two since are The Collapsed and Beyond the Black Rainbow).

post #30783 of 35236

Ah yes, I guess I thought Resident Evil the movie came first. Also, I tend to confuse it with the Underworld series...

post #30784 of 35236
I have very little love or patience for the RESIDENT EVIL or UNDERWORLD series. But I recently caught the latest installments of each and thoroughly enjoyed them. It felt like they stopped pretending to be respectable and just had fun.
post #30785 of 35236
I watched the first of both of those series and never went back to either of those wells again..
post #30786 of 35236
That's very wise, I don't know what I've seen from each, couldn't tell the sequels apart.

I feel like I'm dreaming that I enjoyed the latest ones.
post #30787 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arjen Rudd View Post

DOFP also had Wolverine, which might be significant.

 

Less Wolverine (considering they were coming directly off the second solo film, and that was the lowest grosser in the franchise stateside) and more the fact this was the return of the original cast altogether, a la Fast & Furious 4.

post #30788 of 35236
Unless I'm very mistaken, the three Resident Evil movies I saw were quite fun. The third one has this mad max/The Stand vibe that's genuinely pretty cool.
post #30789 of 35236
Resident Evil 3: Knightmare?
post #30790 of 35236

In a world of reboots, how the hell hasn't this terrible series been rebooted 8 times by now.

post #30791 of 35236

Not having seen any of them, I find it hard to think too badly of the RE series. It seems like the kind of b-movie shlock franchise you don't see too much anymore.

post #30792 of 35236

Any franchise that brings back Michelle Rodriguez despite having killed off her character is doing something right.

post #30793 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul C View Post
 

Not having seen any of them, I find it hard to think too badly of the RE series. It seems like the kind of b-movie shlock franchise you don't see too much anymore.

 

Yes, that franchise is an odd beast, remaining firmly in R-rated, mid-budget territory. And the continuity seems to become weirder and weirder, I never got past the 1st movie (which was fun in its own limited way) but almost want to discover the 5th one, because why not.

post #30794 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magiclapinou View Post
 

 

Yes, that franchise is an odd beast, remaining firmly in R-rated, mid-budget territory. And the continuity seems to become weirder and weirder, I never got past the 1st movie (which was fun in its own limited way) but almost want to discover the 5th one, because why not.

 

Here's why. First 3 minutes and 45 seconds of part 5, the opening sequence is really well done.

 

post #30795 of 35236
The RESIDENT EVIL movies are endearingly colorful, occasionally striking, trash. There's a reason they became a rallying point for vulgar auteurism.
post #30796 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by User_32 View Post
 

In a world of reboots, how the hell hasn't this terrible series been rebooted 8 times by now.

 

They kind of have been in a way. Each movie is different (to quite different) from the others (you could make a case that part 3 is a Western for example) and characters are shuffled in and out again with no real explanation and to where they went and how they came back again. 

 

I wouldn't go as far as recommending seeing any of them but I think they're worth watching random clips from in no particular order on youtube if you have a few minutes to kill. There's some fun set pieces such as:

 

Resident Evil 1:

 

Opening sequence

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zuDZrySShA

 

(also past this point to an unfortunate elevator accident but I can't find the rest from this point but it ends like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGy02Exgw44)

 

Corridor sequence (I remember the audience laughed themselves silly at the end of this sequence).

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8gfGhVL3qs

 

Spence remembers (alternate take on opening)

 

Resident Evil 2 (Apocalypse):

 

Alice versus a licker in a church scene

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3HzHvZIxbyg

 

Umbrella and Raccoon City Police versus zombies

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DHD9tgK7bE

 

Nemesis versus S.T.A.R.S

 

Nemesis versus Alice

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2uJ0ZJ7iTjg

 

Resident Evil 3:

 

Alice versus zombies and then Umbrella in Las Vegas

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CrAToeKGq0E

 

Alice versus the Tyrant

 

Resident Evil 4:

 

Alice(s) versus Umbrella in Tokyo

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mz08OAOhuF8

 

Prison rooftop scene

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBAFeANc2QA

 

Claire and Chris Redfield versus Wesker

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycXgJ2lDT7s

 

Resident Evil 5:

 

Opening sequence (as posted above)

 

Rain Ocampo + Jill Valentine + Olivera + One versus Alice + Ada Wong

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QONEDJyOjdc

 

Alice versus Jill

 

Alice versus Rain

 

Yes, the acting is frequently terrible, along with the decidedly variable special effects and the sequence of events often makes no sense as well as some truly dubious plotting getting from A to B to C (and some of the behind the scenes trivia is just weird, like the voice actress for Ada Wong redubbed the live action actress in part 5) but it's definitively B to C grade fun in parts.

post #30797 of 35236
Yeah, the RE films keep throwing one wacky conceit out there after another. I kinda admire how bonkers it all gets.
post #30798 of 35236
That last one just fully embraces the schlock, now I want to watch it again!
post #30799 of 35236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul C View Post
 

It seems like the kind of b-movie shlock franchise you don't see too much anymore.


This is where I'm at on the RE series, but my 13yo daughter and my wife both love the shit out of every damn one of them (with the exception of maybe 2), and we do a rewatch of them all once a year.  And it's my daughter's 2nd favorite franchise to Fast and Furious...so there's that.

post #30800 of 35236

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